Thanks so much to all Lipsitck Vogue members for this wonderful interview! Great to get the point of view of all four! I had written about Lipstick Vogue, an Irish band that only got to release two songs on a Danceline compilation, but who did record many more songs. The good news were that it didn’t take long for Cathal to contact me on Facebook and we agreed on the interview. Then he got aboard his mates, and here it is, a superb interview with lots of details. Hope you enjoy it as much as I did!

++ Hi Mark, Cathal, Denis! Thanks so much for being up for this interview! How are you? Are you still involved with music?

Mark: Through my job in advertising I still occasionally work with composers and musicians. My Son is now doing drum lesson. So, I’m finally learning how it should be done.

Denis: Not as a player. I still buy records and go to gigs. And I suppose I have a kind of professional interest, as an academic researching early and silent cinema, in what music was played in those venues.

Tony: Not directly, but as I work for a high-profile book publisher, I have met various musicians and bands who have written books. All that must stay confidential.

++ Let’s go back in time. What are your first music memories? Do you remember what your first instrument was? How did you learn to play it? What sort of music did you listen to at home while growing up?

Mark: I loved watching the Beatles movies as a kid. Then The Rolling Stones and the Boomtown Rats were the bands that I really got into. REM came along and that was like discovering the music I actually wanted to make. Through the Stones I discovered Muddy Waters. I got his Hard Again album and got a harmonica to play along to Mannish Boy. 

Denis: My first instrument was probably a tin whistle – a kind of small flute used in Irish traditional music – for school music lessons, but that was more a torture instrument for all concerned, and not an experience likely to engender love of music. I had no other formal musical training.

At home, my mother didn’t have much interest in music, but my father enjoyed classical music and light opera that he mostly listened to on the radio rather than buying records. I slowly requisitioned an old cabinet radio-record player combo, and although I didn’t have much money, I began to buy singles. Bob Marley was an early favourite. Music programmes on TV and radio were also major sources of new sounds. We got UK TV stations in Ireland, so Top of the Pops and The Old Grey Whistle Test on the BBC and the more anarchic The Tube on Channel 4 were staples at various stages.

Tony: First musical memories – Has to be Opera!! My uncle supplied and fitted sound systems to the major supermarkets in Ireland from the 60’s onwards and had serious audio kit at his home. His gig was Opera and on many a Sunday as a child my family and I would visit for dinner, what followed afterwards was a complete loud fest! My internal organs felt like they moved position as the floor vibrated to Verdi!

My first instrument was a Guitar – An acoustic Suzuki, which I confiscated (without a fight) from my eldest brother and which I still have to this day.

How did I learn to play – I fiddled around on it for years before actually learning a single chord, I might have accidentally created a new genre of music by the age of eight.

Music at home – I was the youngest of 5 kids, I had no choice! My one goal in life was to rid this world of Chris De Burgh, Leo Sayer and The Stylistics!!!
I was a blank canvas in my early teens when I fell into the arms of Mark, Cathal, Denis and our other good friends, they deserve all the credit for my musical education.

++ Had you been in other bands before Lipstick Vogue? What about the other band members? Are there any songs recorded?

Mark: No and No. 

Cathal: None of us had been in other bands before really – been to plenty of gigs etc but not really played.

Denis: This was the first band for us all. Mark, Tony and myself did a few gigs as a three piece before Cathal joined out front, with Mark doing the main vocals from behind the kit.

Tony: Never!! That would have been treason.

++ Where were you from originally?

Mark: Dublin

Cathal: We’re all northside Dubliners and knew each other from school in Glasnevin.  Myself and Denis left school in 84 and Mark and Tony in 85.

Denis: Dublin; always Dublin. But I did migrate to the less soulful Southside suburbs after school. I’m back on the Northside of the city now.

Tony: Ballymun, North Dublin – probably best illustrated musically in Running to Stand Still by U2 – I see seven towers, but I only see one way out, add in a diet of Chris De Burgh, Leo Sayer and The Stylistics and the deck is stacked against you. Once again, I credit my band mates and other friends of The Vogues for that one way out.

++ How was Dublin at the time of Lipstick Vogue? Were there any bands that you liked? Were there any good record stores? Or what about the pubs or venues to go check out up and coming bands?

Mark: Economically still quite depressed. A lot of emigration. But the music scene was vibrant. Lots of bands playing live. 

Yea, Something Happens, A House (we supported them a couple of times) A little earlier The Blades. They were the Irish bands we admired. Others were Light a Big Fire, Stars of Heaven.

Were there any good record stores? Freebird records was the go-to indie store. Sounds Around was a another good one. Music World was the closest to home. It wasn’t great but it was local.

The Baggot Inn was the venue that up and coming bands aspired to play. We headlined there and played support to other bands including Auto de Fe, who were produced by Thin Lizzy’s Philip Lynott. David Bowie did a surprise gig with Tim Machine.

Cathal: That period in Dublin was the aftermath of U2 becoming huge so there was a lot of interest from record companies in the next U2.  In addition it was the middle of a huge recession so a lot of unemployment and young people with nothing to do so that combination meant there were a lot of bands playing in Dublin at the time. I liked lot of bands from that period and a lot of them are still playing in one form or other.  Loved Something Happens – very jangly kind of stuff, did cover versions of REM and Jason and the Scorchers alongside Borderline by Madonna. Also the Stars of Heaven who were more Television meets Gram Parsons and had a bit of Indie success in the UK with John Peel sessions etc.  A House were the other big band at that time and were more kind of arty/clever.  Their singer was in college with Mark so we got a support slot with them at some stage.  Light A Big Fire were also kinda big at that time and looked like they might break big but it never happened for them.

The venues really were Underground – a tiny basement bar which ran gigs 7 nights a week and hosted all three bands listed above. I spent a lot of Friday and Saturday nights in there in 1984 and 1985 and a live Mini LP was recorded there around then.  If you outgrew the Underground you moved on to the Baggott Inn which was a more standard music venue and was kinda t-shaped. When Something Happens got a record contract they moved to a Friday night residency there for a while. Another fave of mine – the Blades – also gigged there regularly.  U2 had played there in the late 70’s and it also hosted visiting bands – I saw Wilko Johnson there and Roger McGuinn played there too.  In later years it hosted David Bowie in his Tin Machine incarnation.

As far as record shops go – there was an Irish owned chain which is still operating called Golden Discs which was fairly mainstream but you could find the odd gem in.  I loved Sounds Around on O’Connell St which had more variety and Freebird Records which was on Grafton St at the time.  Freebird is still on the not far from the original shop and I still shop there fairly regularly.  Sadly Sounds Around is long gone.

Denis: Dublin was pretty economically depressed and looked it. A lot if people were on the dole or emigrated after school. Music was a way out of that, in both being something creative to be involved in – connecting with friends and things you were listening to – and Irish bands were seeing some success. We went to a lot of gigs, bigger ones by international acts and often smaller, pub-based ones for local bands. I got a job in the post office straight from school – college came later – which meant I had money for the first time in any useful amounts. A lot of that went on music: records and gigs. I felt I had to make up for lost time, build a collection. Freebird on Eden Quay was the record shop with the best stock of what I was interested in, but I visited them all, looking for something unusual, bargains, whatever.

Lots of pubs had a back room/function room that could be hired for an occasional gig, but there were venues that specialized in gigs and had back line and a sound engineer. The main places where we went to see local bands were places we played in later ourselves: the Ivy Rooms, the Underground and the Baggot Inn. The more successful bands played clubs like McGonagle’s, the TV Club or even the SFX.

Tony: Both Mark and Cathal have pretty much nailed this one in their replies, it was grim, but it was also fun, there was a unique character to Dublin and characters in Dublin back then.

++ Were there any other good bands in your area?

Cathal: I didn’t really know any other bands in the area (Cabra/Glasnevin/Ballymun) but there were a lot of bands in Finglas which was close by including Aslan whose singer Christy Dignam passed away recently.  A few work friends were in bands too – Pat Dalton in the Anthill Mob and Joe McDonnell in Giant.

Denis: The area of the city I grew up in – Glasnevin – is famous as the site of the city’s largest cemetery. Growing up, there wasn’t much for the living, and no local bands I was aware of. You had to go into the city for that.

Tony: We all hung out together and went to the same gigs, once again I refer to my learned colleagues.

++ How was the band put together? How was the recruiting process? You were brothers? related?

++ Was there any lineup changes?

Mark: No, there were only ever four Vogues. Much like the Beatles. 

++ How was the creative process for you? Where did you usually practice?

Mark: We’d jam ideas for songs, usually starting with some riff or chord sequence that Tony came up with on guitar, or a bass line from Denis. Cathal and myself would contribute lyrics. We’d put it together and see what happens. We rehearsed mostly in a place called Alan Furlong Studios in Dublin. A kip.

Cathal: At first we practiced in a friend’s garage and then rented rehearsal rooms in Alan Furlong’s studios which was pretty run down but we rehearsed there twice a week for a good while and that was where we would have written most of the songs that are on that Soundcloud page.  Often the songs would  start off with a guitar riff from Tony but Mark and myself usually had bits of lyrics on the go too. As thing progressed it was something from everyone really though.

Denis: Somebody would have an idea that we all worked on at rehearsals, developing the various parts and arrangements. In the early days, we rehearsed in our parents’ houses, which was not popular with family or neighbours. Better for a while was a friend’s large house which had a part where a crèche operated during the week but was largely free on weekends. Later, we would meet at one or other, most dingy, rehearsal studio.

++ What’s the story behind the band’s name?

Mark: Took it from an Elvis Costello Song. I liked the sound of it. Maybe I thought it was a bit New York Dolls or something. Kinda punky, but sort of smart. Anyway, we went with it. 

Cathal:Taken from Elvis Costello song – much loved by us all. If I remember rightly it was decided at a band meeting in Mark’s kitchen but now I’m wondering were the 3 piece version called something different….

Denis: Unhappy with a previous moniker and needing a change for an upcoming gig, we were listening to some Elvis Costello and the Attractions in Mark’s house when “Lipstick Vogue” came on. The rest is rock-and-roll history.

Tony: We just loved that Elvis Costello song, it pretty much had everything to aspire to musically so the name just stuck.

++ My favourite song of yours is “River’s End”, wondering if you could tell me what inspired this song? What’s the story behind it?

Mark: That’s one for Cathal to answer. 

Tony: Cathal Peppard – our great wordsmith can answer that one.

Cathal: Listening back to it now as I write this.  Pretty sure the lyric is mostly me.  Think it was the standard dark come on to a girl type of song but living in Dublin there has to be lot of bad weather references!! Don’t think it worked as a come on either!  In general though I tend to agree with Ian McCulloch that it’s more about what words sound good with the melody.  The music is great on there too – especially like the staccato drum thing at end of the chorus.

++ If you were to choose your favorite Lipstick Vogue song, which one would that be and why?

Mark: Maybe, Walk Alone. I still think it could be a hit! 

Cathal:I think it’s a toss up between Anywhere But Here and Walk Alone.  Anywhere… has that kind of Stars of Heaven sound and some lovely guitars. If I remember Mark wrote most of the lyrics with a bit of input from me when we were in London touting the demo around. The kindred spirit mentioned in the song is Don McKevitt who we were staying with and who had a band called the Kindred Spirits.  Loved to play Walk Alone live – it was good and noisy and we often opened gigs with it!

Denis: “Walk Alone”, when it worked, was the one in which I felt we were most together.

++ What about gigs? Did you play many?

Mark: Yea, a good few. Do wish now, in retrospect, that maybe we should have gone over to London to play, just to experience it.  

++ You mentioned that there were Hot Press band competitions gigs in Cork. How did you fare in them?

Mark: We played it once in 1988. We were robbed!

++ And what were the best gigs in general that you remember? Any anecdotes you can share?

Mark: We did a gig on the 4th of July in the Baggot Inn, I remember that as being amazing. And that’s the way I will always remember it. 

Cathal: The 4th July gig in the Baggott was a good one – we had decent songs and were a fairly tight unit by then.  We played a version of Patti Smith’s Dancing Barefoot in most of the sets with a medley of other tunes including Gimmer Shelter in it and I especially loved that.  We also played a reunion gig in 2003 (I think) in the Sugar Club (the other side of Stephen’s Green from Windmill 2!) and that was a good night – mix of the tunes from the Soundcloud page and covers – Driver 8 (REM), Wide Open Road (Triffids), State Trooper (Bruce) and Creep (Radiohead).

Denis: I don’t think it was our best musical moment, but we somehow got into a Battle of the Bands in one of the distant southern suburbs of Dublin. I think it was a church hall, and there was an attempt by the people running the event to limit alcohol consumption. Having none of this, we proceeded to get pissed on beer we had brought in with our gear, played out set and expected to get thrown out. Instead, we won the competition. We felt we’d raised some hell.

Tony: 4th July, Baggot Inn. Everything clicked. I remember irritating numerous Trinity college students as I stuck up posters in the archway of the College in the days leading up to the gig, they weren’t too pleased with the American flag design and staged a political protest there and then.

++ And were there any bad ones?

Mark: Yea. But let’s move on. 

Cathal: Oh yeah!  Remember playing to a handful of people upstairs in the Earl Grattan – the gig wasn’t bad per se but the attendance was a bit demoralising!  Still it’s the kinda thing that happens to all bands I suppose.

Denis: Quite a few, no doubt, but not worth remembering.

Tony: All memories have been erased, bad make you get better.

++ When and why did Lipstick Vogue stop making music? Were any of you involved with other bands afterwards?

Mark: No, I think we all left it behind after that, really. I think we finished because we had other things that we wanted to do. Further education, jobs etc. 

Cathal: Around the end of 89 – was just a feeling that things had run their course.  I don’t recall anyone being in bands afterwards.  Tony did a course as a sound engineer but don’t remember anything beyond that really.

Denis: It began to feel like another job added to the day jobs we all had. The breakup was amicable, but it crystalized my decision to leave the post office and start filmmaking and eventually university. For me, some rehearsals with Niall Austin was about the only musical thing I was involved in afterwards.

Tony: No bands, I had a short-lived dalliance with sound engineering which didn’t come to anything.

++ Was there any interest from the radio? TV?

Mark: We got played on the legendary Dave Fanning Show on 2FM. That was the one show all the bands listened to and wanted to be on. 

Cathal: Think the Swimming Out of the Pool tracks got an airing on Dave Fanning’s radio show – he played alternative stuff and demos etc from Irish bands.  They also did sessions for bands but we didn’t do one of those.

++ What about the press? Did they give you any attention?

Mark: Couple of reviews in Hot Press magazine. 

Cathal: Some reviews in the Hot Press for gigs/Swimming Out of the Pool/demos.  Maybe a notice in In Dublin too – a listings magazine at that time.

Denis: We got some coverage in Hot Press but felt we should have got more as we drank with them in the International Bar.

Tony: The legendary Bill Graham reviewed us in The Irish Press after seeing one of our gigs and compared us to Television!! That was either a highlight or a dream! I’m sure it happened.

++ What about fanzines?

Mark: No. I don’t remember fanzines being a big thing in Dublin. But maybe I just wasn’t interested. I only read the NME.

Cathal: Can’t say as I recall fanzines in Dublin at that time – would have been a small scene for them during punk I think but not much after that.

Denis: I wasn’t really aware of a big fanzine scene at the time.

Tony: I’m afraid not, we might have been to early for that bus.

++ Looking back in retrospect, what would you say was the biggest highlight for the band?

Mark: Probably that 4th of July gig. And getting a couple of tunes out on vinyl. And just having three great mates and a small band of followers who were all great people to be around.

++ Aside from music, what other hobbies do you have?

Mark: I think we were all interested in cinema and other areas of the arts. 

Cathal: While I don’t play I still collect music and listen to a lot so that takes up a fair bit of my spare time.

Denis: Going to the cinema, swimming in the North Atlantic.

Tony:Travel, reading, gardening, walking, cinema and arts in general.

++ I’ve been to Dublin once and really had a good time there. But still I’d love to ask a local. What do you  suggest checking out in your town, like what are the sights one shouldn’t miss? Or the traditional food or drinks that you love that I should try?

Mark: I think the best thing about Dublin is to enjoy it without much of a plan. See where it takes you. Have a Guinness. Have fish and chips from Burdocks in Christchurch. I’m afraid the live music scene is nothing like it used to be. But do go to a trad music session.

Cathal: Lots of good pubs – away from the tourist trail of Temple Bar etc.  The Long Hall, the International Bar, Grogans, Idlewild – all around the Georges St/Grafton St area. Just wander around and that area and see what you fancy.  If you’re venturing outside the city centre do the Glasnevin Cemetery tour and have a pint in the Gravediggers! As far as music goes there are still plenty of venues – the Workmans, Whelans and the Grand Social have a mix of local and visiting bands. Have a look to see what’s on in the Olympia – lovely Victorian theatre which recently hosted Wilco (Mark was there) and the likes of Paul Weller, Jason Isbell.

Denis: The Dublin pub remains an important institution. Have a sneaky pint in the middle of the day. The city has become much more ethnically diverse since the 1990s and has many good restaurants that reflect this; areas like Parnell Street or Stoneybatter are worth visiting for this reason.

++ Anything else you’d like to add?

Mark: Thanks for showing an interest! Keep up the good work!

Cathal: Not really- was a nice trip down memory lane alright.  Always nice to hear someone enjoy the songs.  Thanks for the mention and look forward to reading more on the Cloudberry blog.

Denis: Thanks for asking and invoking the memories.

Tony: I think that it. Thanks for showing interest and liking the music we but out.