Thanks so much to Stefan Wesley for the interview! I wrote about Alfie some time ago on the blog, and Tore Höghielm, the band’s bassist got in touch. He then put me in touch with Stefan, who was the guitarist of the band, and he was so kind to answer all my questions concerning his band that was active in Visby, Sweden, in the late 80s. They only released one 7″ single, with two should-have-been classics, and some tapes that they sold at gigs and on demand. Online there is so little written about them, that it was a good chance to learn about them. Hope you enjoy this interview!

++ Hi Stefan! Thanks so much for being up for this interview. Alfie has always been a mystery to me, so I’m glad to get to know a bit about your band! Perhaps let’s start from the beginning, what are your first musical memories? when did you learn to play guitar? what inspired you?

My first musical memory is my mothers single- and EP-collection. It wasn’t big, it wasn’t great, but it had some records I enjoyed at very young age and that I still like a lot today. I was very much into cowboys and indians as a child, so I especially liked “Rawhide” by Eric Wilson-Hyde and Johnny Horton’s “North to Alaska”. Other favourites included Russ Conway’s “Matador from Trinidad”, Sam Cooke’s “Chain Gang”, plus instrumental bands like Johnny & The Hurricanes, The Fireballs and The Spotnicks.

++ When was Alfie formed? And had you been involved with any other bands before?

In 1980 we started a punk band at school. We changed name a few times before ending up with Castro. But quite soon I discovered The Sound of Young Scotland, fell in love with Josef K, Orange Juice, Aztec Camera and other Scottish bands like Fire Engines and Boots For Dancing. So we changed style and became more of a pop band. In 1982, I think, we translated the lyrics to English and changed name to Season’s Greetings, introducing The Sound of Young Gotland. We played our farewell gig in May 1986.

During this time, I had a couple of tape labels, CA Productions and Enjoy Tapes, releasing acts like Biljardakademien, Trumslagarpojkarna, Control Addicts, Eucalypso, M.O.M.S. and others, all including me and/or my brothers.

++ Why the name Alfie? Does it have to do with the movie?

When we started, we needed a name real quick because we already had a gig booked. So I looked through my record collection and came up with the name Too Sensitives, after an Orange Juice song. But it was too difficult for people to comprehend so we changed name to The Boy Wonders, after the Aztec Camera song. We were quite happy with that name but suddenly read in NME about a new British band called Boys Wonder, so we changed name again before “we make it big”. This time, I came up with the name Alfie and it’s of course after the 1966 Michael Caine movie, but it’s even more after the Burt Bacharach/Hal David song.

++ How did Alfie start as a band? How did you all meet?

After the final Season’s Greetings gig in May 1986, I took the bass player, Henrik Johansson, with me and started a new band right away. We had my little brother Magnus Häglund on drums but needed a vocalist. I shared an apartment with a few people and one of them was dating a guy called Mattias Ek who one day was sitting in the kitchen singing to the radio. So when we a couple of months later I remembered him singing to this song by Swedish band Ratata and that it didn’t sound that bad. So I asked Mattias if he wanted to try singing with us.

So we had our first rehearsals in June 1986 and played two songs at a local pop band competition in July (I think). Towards the end of the summer, my older brother, Kjell Häglund, said he had met a guy at a party who had good taste in music and played the guitar, so I contacted this Johan Arvidsson and recruited him to join the band. Johan had only been with us for a couple of weeks when Henrik said he was moving away for studies, so we needed a new bass player. I immediately came to think of Tore Höghielm who I first met years earlier in German class at secondary school. We didn’t hang out or anything but every time we ran into each other we used to say that we should start a band together. He already played in one or two other bands but didn’t hesitate to join Alfie.

++ What sort of music were you all into at that time? Who would you call as influences of the band? I assume the Postcard Records stuff because of the “Sound of Young Gotland” nod on the sleeve?

I don’t really remember any specific influences, as we always listened to everything and anything. But I remember sometime in 1986 or 1987 when I really discovered all those new indie bands like McCarthy, Jasmine Minks, BMX Bandits, Primal Scream, My Bloody Valentine, The Pastels etc. Don’t think they changed our music though, but maybe a little.

++ You were based in Visby back then. Are you still there? And what were the places to hang out or catch a gig in town?

Yes, we were based in Visby. When Alfie quit, it was because three of out members moved to Stockholm. I tried to maintain the band with my brother Magnus, writing songs and recording demos, and Mattias came on visit to add vocals to the demos, but it didn’t work.
I still live in Visby, and so does Johan who came back after a couple of years of studying. Magnus lived here until a couple of years ago when he moved to Gävle. Mattias and Tore lives in Stockholm.
Visby in the late 80’s had no specific scene for catching bands, but the local music association Roxy arranged some concerts. A new café/pub called Schenholms also had bands playing.

++ Were there any other like-minded bands in town during those mid and late 80s?

Nope, not a single one.

++ What about in Sweden in general? Did you like any bands then? I’m always curious about that period of Sweden, it seems it was only in the 90s that there was a much more known explosion of guitar pop bands, but I always find, after digging a bit, obscure jewels from the 80s!

The 80’s was mostly into the dark side of post punk and you never heard bands like Orange Juice and Aztec Camera (that I tried to sound like with Season’s Greetings). But in the late 80’s bands like This Perfect Day and The Wannadies started to pop up and then came the explosion you mentioned. But I liked a lot of the Swedish music in the 80’s like Reeperbahn, Di Leva and garage bands like Pushtwangers and The Stomach Mouths.

++ You released the one 7″, with “Play On” and “Fool to Fall”, if you wouldn’t mind, would you tell me the story behind these two songs? What are they about?

There’s not much to tell, really. “Play On” was written a couple of years earlier and when we started Alfie and had our first gig just a few weeks later we needed a simple song to start with. And it can’t be much simpler than “Play On”. And “Fool To Fall”… I can’t remember anything from writing it. When we went to the recording studio, we had maybe five songs and these two we thought would be best.

++ Also, what do you remember of the recording session for the single at Sandvike Studio?

My brother, Kjell Häglund, worked on an album with Biljardakademien, and suggested that we could go there a weekend to record a couple of songs. There were place left on one of his 24 channel tapes we could use. Today, the studio is in Visby, but back then it was way out in the middle of nowhere. So we went there and recorded the background tracks the first day, slept over and then recorded the overdubs the day after. Not the most interesting story, guess we were a quite boring band.

++ And how did they creative process work for Alfie?

It always started with me sitting at home with my guitar trying to find new melodies and chord progressions. We rehearsed maybe once a week were went through our repertoire and then testing some of my new ideas. I guess I had a new song almost every rehearsal. I also used to have an idea how everyone else should play. Sometimes it worked, sometimes not, but we completed each other very well so it usually turned out quite ok, even if it sounded different in my head.

++ Did you ever consider making songs in Swedish perhaps?

No, we didn’t. As no one in Sweden were interested in our music, maybe someone was it abroad. But there wasn’t.

++ The record was released on a label called Enjoy. Who was behind it?

It was my (and Magnus) tape label’s only vinyl release.

++ On Discogs there’s a live tape listed. It’s a tape with a bunch of songs from a gig at the Roxy in Visby from March 11 1988. Was this tape sold? It says too that the whole B side was just encores! You must have had a very good following!

As all Enjoy’s tape releases, it was made on demand and we didn’t do much to sell it. So I have no idea how many copies we sold, but maybe 50. We liked to play a few covers as encores and the audience used to like it as well. It was songs by anyone from Depeche Mode to AC/DC, all played in a special Alfie style.

++ Were there any other tapes, or perhaps releases, or even compilation appearances by Alfie?

Yes, two more tapes actually. About a year after the single we started recording an album called “Home Again, Finnegan”. We never finished the recordings but a rough mix of it was released on cassette. And after the band split up, I made a bunch of demos with Magnus and had Mattias coming over to do the vocals. We released the demos on tape as “Welcome to Alfieville”

++ There’s also another song, “Another Girl”, that appears on a CDR compilation called “Recycled:Inhouse”. I’ve tried finding it, same as the single, with no luck, the label didn’t reply my emails. How did this song, recorded in 1989, got released many decades after? Also on this compilation you contribute with many other bands. Perhaps this compilation is the real Sound of Young Gotland?

Once again, I’m the one to blame. I was planning a website about the old tape label, but what’s the point when you can’t hear the music. So I was thinking about different ways to make the music available. I really wanted all to be free and downloadable, but at the time this alternative was quite expensive. So I found this on demand manufacturer and decided to make CD’s. The “Recycled: Inhouse” collection features music by me and/or my brothers.
Sorry to hear you haven’t had a reply on your email. A couple of the email addresses have been hijacked and locked so that could be the reason. But the CD is still available in the web store and it’s also available as download from various digital stores.

++ There’s another song mentioned in the label page, “(A Lovely Day for) Goalkeeping”. It says it have been thought to be lost. What have happened to it?

The song was made for a tape compilation but didn’t make it. It was the last song Alfie recorded.

++ Now I wonder, were there many more Alfie recordings done in those late 80s that never got to see the light of day?

Only the unfinished album and the demos I mentioned.

++ Have you ever thought of releasing perhaps an Alfie compilation?

Yes, it was the plan when I started Bendi ten years ago, and it still is. Next year it’s time, I think!

++ Now time to talk about gigs. Did you play many of them? What cities did you play? What were the best and worst gigs that you remember? and why? Any anecdotes would be great!

Can’t say we did many gigs. We only played in Visby and a couple of other smaller places on Gotland. We were quite good live, I think, since the audiences used to like us, even if they hadn’t heard us before. But we were probably quite boring as well since I have no anecdotes to speak of.

++ And what about press, radio, that sort of thing, did you get support from them? How easy or difficult was back then in Sweden? Was there any sort of scene going on?

The local press wrote about us a few times, and they are always positive. We sent the single to music papers etc but no one bothered to mention us at all. It would probably have been easier if we was part of a scene, but we were the only happy guitar pop band around.

++ Then what happened with the band? When and why did you call it a day?

Most young people on Gotland leave for Stockholm or some other place to study or work, and so did three of our members. It was in 1989 I think, leaving me and my brother Magnus in Visby.

++ Were you all involved with music afterwards? What did you do?

We have all played in various bands of various kinds and quality. Tore played with Swedish legend Henrik Venant for a while, and Bendi released an album with his band Solicium. Magnus was one half of Kill Squad vs Doubleheader who released a couple of EP’s on Superstudio. I made an album as The Luckiest Citizen Of All a few years ago.

++ And today, are you still making music? Any other hobbies that you enjoy doing?

Tore is the only one playing regularly. I wish I had more time to make music! I’m involved in a couple of bands that only rehearse when we have a gig every second year or so. But I have a lot of plans for various projects.
There are so many fun things to do! I’m a part of a TV and film blog called tvdags.se. And for the last year I’ve been involved in local politics for the Feminist Initiative party. Notnas a politician, but behind the curtains.

++ You used to run a blog too, Unga Moderna, what happened to it? Are you still writing?

Everything takes time… I can’t remember exactly, but something else became more important at the time. Nowadays I only write a very little about TV on tvdags.se.

++ I always ask about the touristy side of things… I’ve been to Sweden a bunch of times, never to Visby though. Perhaps you can point me out what to do, what to try and what to drink that is really traditional in your town?

Visby is an old Hanseatic town and the whole island is a giant tourist attraction. Actually, there is so much to write about so I suggest you check on Tripadvisor, Virtualtourist or just Google. It’s a tourists paradise in the summer and very nice all other seasons.

++ Has it changed a lot since your Alfie days?

Not really. Of course it has changed, but not more than any other place.

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Listen
Alfie – Fool to Fall

Some weeks ago I wrote about The Divorce Brothers on the blog. Happily Ged Lerpinière got in touch with me some days ago and was kind enough to answer all my questions about the band in the 80s. It was great as I got some facts wrong on my post and now I know a bit about that scene of Dundee thanks to his thorough answers! Hope you enjoy reading it as I did!

++ Thanks so much Ged for the interview! How are you? It seems I totally got it wrong earlier on, you weren’t from Perth but from Dundee! Are you still based there?

I’m fine Roque thanks for asking. Yes The Divorce Brothers were from Dundee. I think only one of us lives there now. I live outside of Edinburgh.

++ How was Dundee back then? Were there any other like-minded bands? In what venues or places would you usually hang out?

Well Dundee was a lot of fun back then. The music scene was kind of centred around Fat Sams which still seems to be going strong. The Associates and Danny Wilson were contemporaries of ours and I’m sure you know all about them. We hung out with Gary Clarke, Ged Grimes and Kit from the Danny’s Ged is now bass player for Simple Minds. And The Divorce Brothers had a lot of cross over from The Associates. Billy was a pal and Alberts brother in law. Ian MacIntosh played guitar in the Associates, Roberto Soave played bass for them (good friend who turned out for us once or twice I think?) he also played with The Cure briefly. Liz McKenzie was Billy McKenzie’s sister. Jimmy McKenzie also played bass with us for a while towards the end. Martin Lowe also played guitar for us for a while and he made an album with the great Scottish Musician Martin Bennet in the mid 2000’s.

The other bands that were around were Sweden Thru The Ages led by Stephen Knight who is still making music and released an album ‘Rope and Vine’ last year which I recommend you look up on line. Inca Rhodes which featured Colin Knight and Setting Fires whose singer was Kim Pallas. I’m a bit hazy after that. Before this period 84-87 ish there were a lot of punks bands and before that big hitters like the Average White band also with Perth connections. Then Skeets Boliver, which featured the wonderful Marra brothers (Michael, Chris, and Eddie) amongst others.

++ Before The Divorce Brothers, were you involved in any other bands? Or was this your first experience in a band?

I had played drums and percussion in a pretty terrible free form mess called ‘The Soul Vibration Posse’ I think. The name was the only good thing about us. And I had played drums on a couple of bad demo recordings and did some working mens club gigs, but that is going back a long way and can’t remember much about them. Ian roped me in to the band to add some colour on percussion we were a gang as much as a band.

++ How did the band start? Where did you all meet?

Ian and Albert are brothers, Paul was their brother in law and Derek and I were pals of theirs. They had a previous incarnation as Loco Jonny Mince! I think; and you guessed it, that band featured another McKenzie; Billy’s brother John was the singer. But it kind of morphed into the Divorce Brothers.

++ And where does the name come from?

Well Ian was divorced and Albert was his brother I think Roberto Soave suggested the name I can’t remember exactly.

++ What bands would you say influenced your music back then?

A lot of what would be called ‘Indy stuff’ now, so yes the Associates as Ian supplied the guitar for many of the tracks on ‘Perhaps’ and toured with them and was involved in the writing. But we had lots of different ideas. Albert was very much of the rock and roll Eddie Cochrane and Punk ethic. Ian was into; Small Faces, Zombies, Steve Marriot stuff but also very classy pop so I remember we were very taken with The Propaganda Album ‘A Secret Wish.’ The Cure Album ‘Head on the Door’ was a big favourite as was ‘Stop Making Sense’ and ‘Remain in Light’ the Talking Heads ideas on rhythm interested me a lot, still do. Roxy Music were always an influence and Ian still thinks Avalon is one of the classiest albums ever made. I think we nicked the girl vocals on the end of the track Avalon for ‘To Understand’ (attached). We had eclectic taste though I went from The Clash and Ry Cooder to plenty far out prog and jazz stuff that everyone hated. But if It’s worth nicking you can find things in all sorts of places. Two of my favourite bands at the time were Microdysney and the Railway Children. Perfect pop music and some great lyrics especially Microdysney.

++ You only released one record in 1986. It came out on Separation Records. Who were they?

Separation records was our own label. We distributed it through something called the Cartel it sold poorly, very poorly.

++ What do you remember from the recording session for that record?

Gibson studios was a tiny space in Carnoustie so I remember it being small! The control desk was in a space under an elevated bed. I can remember doing the timbale break on To understand thinking I might bash my elbows off the wall. We had rehearsed and knew our parts but it was our first real experience but Ian had done it before so he was the ‘guvnor’. But to be honest its 30 years ago so pretty hazy.

++ There were 5 songs on the record, which one was your favourite and why?

Well I think we wrote some better songs later. I loved The Divorcee as this was the song we opened with and Paul and I would open up on percussion. But I think ‘To Understand’ is the best song. The Liquidator is our homage to Sergio Leonne.

++ And how did the creative process work for The Divorce Brothers?

Well it changed as we evolved. But originally Albert and Ian wrote everything and brought it to the group and we worked on refining it into structured songs everyone chipping in ideas. We rehearsed often in Fat Sams as Derek was also an employee there. Then later others started to bring ideas in, a bass line here, a groove there, a lyric or melody. But the Divorce Brothers EP is very much the MacIntosh brothers writing.

++ How did Liz, the sister from Bill McKenzie of The Associates, collaborated on the record? Were you from the same scene perhaps?

Well yeah as I say she was married to Albert and we all hung around together.

++ And what about the Soul Kiss Club that is thanked on the sleeve. How important was it to you guys?

That was Nick and Chris Wright who were a couple of friends who ran what would maybe called ‘Pop Up’ events now. They would hire say the Tayside Bar or The West Port bar and play music’. I think they put on bands occasionally as well so we probably played with them. I remember a great gig at the Blue Mountain pub where both of us were involved. Chris and Nick were good guys, great taste in music always something new, oh and Steff I think?

++ So what about gigs? Did you play many? Any anecdotes you could share?

Er yes we played many gigs over 100 I believe but could be wrong Ian probably knows. There are some stories that cannot be told or you and I would be sued! But the personnel changed and after Derek left. We got in a very good keyboard player Drew Scobie and at his first gig there was fight and Ian was hauled off stage, in his second a girl danced onto the stage and we all parted like the Red Sea and allowed her to dance in front of Drew and she started playing with his bald head, in the third he was accosted by a drunk in Peterhead who kept sticking his head in front of Drews keyboard so Drew couldn’t see what he was doing. I think Drew had a good time though! Our ‘manager’, a bloke who shall remain nameless, was also a bit of a spoofer (liar) so we could turn up at gigs and not know what he had told the management before we arrived. So we once saw a poster telling the audience to watch Top of The Pops on Thursday because we would be on it. It was all rubbish of course but maybe we got a few more quid as a result.

++ What about press then? Did you get much radioplay? Or perhaps appearances on magazines or fanzines?

Yes we got a bit of local air time Radio Tay and Radio Forth and it got played on Radio 1 I think but I might have imagined that. Ian and Albert occasionally get a cheque for 9p (not much) so someone has played the record every now and then. We had gigs featured in local press all over the place, the NME etc. Local fanzines covered us the names of which are sketchy in the memory I think 99 Free? called us ‘Ignoble’, we had to look it up! Albert and I took issue with the reviewer, we turned him upside down in Fat Sams and tickled him!

++ You were around during those mid, late 80s, there was a big explosion of guitar pop bands in the UK, so I think it’s fair to ask why do you think this happened?

I think that scenes develop for lots of reasons most are a reaction to what went before. What went before was Wham and a lot of glossy horrible pop, what went before Punk was overblown Symphonic rock. Fashion I suppose. There will always be guitar bands it depends what you do with it as to whether it’s popular or fashionable which are not the same thing And neither of those things necessarily make you good!. The Stone Roses were I suppose the epitome of cool at that time. But you can hear, The Byrds, Small Faces, The Who in that sound but after that they went a bit Dance orientated as a response to the fashion, and the drugs at the time.

++ You were telling me you recorded many more songs. Were they sold on demo tapes perhaps? Or perhaps they haven’t been heard yet by the no one? Do you remember the names of them?

There are some demos’ and if I can get them into some form of digital format I’ll see if we can forward to you but most of it is lost I think. The names: There is: ‘Experience’ which is groove and bass thing, ‘Shake the hand of a Millionaire’ which would have been a number one on all continents and made us Millionaires (maybe `8¬) )’One Night in a small Town Cabaret, ‘Go’, ‘You bring out the worst in me’ and some others I can’t remember.

++ And why didn’t you release these songs?

We were falling apart in about 1988 as we had to get on with our lives. It started to be not that important; that and we were not very well organised. We didn’t get signed so we didn’t have the energy to try again. We didn’t want to be the guys in the bar who people would mutter at ‘Jesus give it up guys’.

++ Was there ever any interest from other labels?

Yes we had a show case for Warner Brothers and London records. London records ‘apparently’ decided to spend the money on Love and Money instead. Some you win. But it was already becoming a bit of challenge to keep the enthusiasm going at this point. And I think a lot of the responsibility was falling on Ian which wasn’t fair.

++ Have you ever thought in maybe putting together some sort of compilation of all Divorce Brothers songs?

No as I can’t find much more than 8 tracks. I don’t think it has crossed anyone’s mind. Who would listen to it? But if we do you’ll be the first to know Roque.

++ So when and why did you split?

Split is a bit dramatic. The Divorce Brothers petered out in about 1988. Ian and I went into education, Albert concentrated on his business, I have lost touch with Drew, Paul was already an engineer doing very well and Derek left to work in the entertainment business.

++ Were you all involved with music after The Divorce Brothers?

Well in about 2010 Ian and I formed a band called Sinderins with our friend Ian Caddell, who sadly passed away in 2011 we have some demo’s and I’ll see what I can come up with for you. Attached is a file of a song Ian and I recorded a few years ago I’m singing, did the drum pattern and a bit of percussion, Ian played everything else. I wrote the song in response to the summer 2011 riots in England. Hence ‘5 Days in July’. We performed briefly as ‘The Jyne’ with two other friends but this split in 2012.

I played in Steve Knights band ‘Any Wednesday’ and have sat in as dep drummer for loads of people. But having kids takes up time and joining a band is a big commitment. Ian more or less gave up music after he qualified as an Engineer until I persuaded him to join Sinderins. He remains a great musician in my book.

++ Are you all still in touch? What are you up to these days?

I work in Education.

Ian is an Engineer running his own business. Albert still runs a business in Dundee and I’ve seen him recently. I keep in touch with Derek but don’t know what happened to the other guys. Maybe I should use Facebook? And sadly some of the people mentioned above are no longer with us.

++ Aside from music, what other hobbies do you enjoy doing?

I am an artist http://www.marchmontgallery.com/Lerpinire-Ged(2386281).htm I have two exhibitions next year and will be exhibiting at Summerhall Gallery in Edinburgh on the weekend of 22nd November. And I run a lot.

++ I’ve been to Scotland a couple of times and I love it, never to Dundee though. Wouldn’t mind some tips on what to see and what’s traditional to eat there?

In Dundee!! You should eat: Pies, White puddings and Sare heid Cakes (sore head cakes) pretty unhealthy food!

Have a walk up the Law and you can see for miles around. I used to drink in the Tay Bridge Bar which is immortalised in song by the wonderful Michael Marra https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1X0rqVVAmXw

++ And one last question, looking back, what do you think was the biggest highlight for The Divorce Brothers?

I really enjoyed the gigs and being the first Dundee band to headline Fat Sams Dance Factory and hanging out with my friends. It was all part of growing up.

++ Thanks a lot! Anything else you’d like to add?

No just hello to Paul, Ian, Derek, Abe, Drew, Roberto, Bryan McDermott, Alison Burns and Martin Lowe who were all Divorce Brothers at one time or another and I didn’t mention Irene so hello Irene.

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Listen
The Divorce Brothers – That First Kiss

Thanks so much to Martin and Keith for the interview! I wrote years ago about the Sugar Glyders on the blog and was lucky to get in touch with them lately. They released only one single, and they seemed a bit obscure online, so it was such a great chance and opportunity to learn more about from this great band from Hemel Hampstead from the mid 80s!

++ Hi! Thanks much for being up for this interview. It’s great to know more about your band, there’s so little about it online. So why don’t we start from the beginning. What are your first music memories as a kid? And how did you end up playing your instruments?

Martin: The Beatles on Royal Variety Show tv show. Prior to that, Adam Faith’s  ‘What do you want’ is a strong memory, as it happened to be playing one Xmas morning when I was very little, as I opened the case of my first guitar! My Mum and Dad were both musicians (Dad was lead trumpet with the Ted Heath Orchestra and Mum sang with the Squadronnaires). Music was a passion in our house.

Keith: Grew up in a household with very little music in it, remember being intrigued by the mention of someone releasing  ‘an album’ in a radio interview. The smell and sounds of records shops in general did a lot for me. Got the chance to play a drum kit, which I took to straight away, albeit in the simplest way possible. Some things never change.

++ Were you all involved in any other bands before being in the Sugar Glyders? I read some of you were in Spoils? How did they sound? Any releases?

Martin: yes, ‘Born Free’ a cabaret style covers band (functions, weddings, parties etc.)-70s rubbish, before that ‘The Stroll Band’, which toured Holland and Germany, also covers stuff. Later with Brian (keyboards) and Chris (bass) (both surnames long forgotten) in ‘Character’.

Keith: yes, lots of rubbish/ learning type bands that never managed a gig, later Pigs Might Fly which did manage some gigs, but fell apart as too many distractions came along (marriage, work, apathy etc.). Martin Benson was in that band, later to become a Spoils person. Later in a band Hotel, which led to me meeting Martin. Spoils in a bit more detail further on.

++ And then how did the band start? How did you all get to know each other?

Martin, Keith: Hotel and Character were playing the same venue The Arts Centre, Hemel Hempstead, now demolished, not by us. Hotel’s bass player Gary, was a friend of Martin’s. So we met through Gary and music really.

Keith: I seem to recall Martin asking me to sit in with Character as they had no drummer, I declined as the bar was downstairs and I had no idea of any of the songs. I did listen to some of the set though. I liked Martin’s playing, I remember some song about a ‘Silver Highway’ and thought he was a great player.

Martin: I was really impressed with Keith’s playing, hence my asking him to sit in with my band. Plus he was hilarious in person and we hit it off instantly as people.

Martin, Keith: ‘Spoils’ was eventually put together around 1977 from parts of Hotel and Character, Keith knew Martin Benson, who was simply a great chords man, and a great bloke, too. He was earlier in Pigs and not doing much when we grabbed him.

Spoils finally was Martin guitar, Keith drums, Martin Benson (Benny) guitar, Gary Williams, bass. Gary and Benny later both succumbed to marriage, not to each other of course, but that left M & K to return to demo recording to knock up some kind of set, if we ever found another bass player that is. Circa 1981, enter the Portastudio, the famous cassette based recording machine that kept things ticking over, and the ideas flowing.Bass – wise, after several attempts, we found Paul Thomson, (Tommo) who was a bit younger, with different influences, but wanted to play and picked things up quickly.By the time we started to gig again, there was a huge choice of songs to pick from, and all were blueprinted, if you will.

++ Tell me a bit about Hemel Hampstead. That’s where you were based right? Were there any good places to play gigs? Were there any other like minded bands in town?

Martin, Keith: Hemel Hempstead is a New Town (British post war developments to handle the demand for bombed – out Londoners to live in new, green spaces). Usually concrete sprawls, where the kids’ had nothing to do. Other nearby towns had better venues, such as St. Albans, Watford & Hertford, but it was still difficult to get anywhere to see bands or socialise.

Martin, Keith: Like minded bands? No, like minded players? Yes.

++ It was 1984 when you released your single. What were you listening to at that time? What were your favourite bands?

Martin, Keith: mostly 70s era, in no order of preference, Dan, Zappa, Blockheads, Pirates, Who, Beatles, Hendrix, Stevie Wonder, Boz Scaggs, Joni Mitchell80s stuff was broadly already heavily electronic, so not much of that.

++ This single you released included two songs, “Revenge” and “Free Your Heart”. Care telling me the story behind these two songs?

Martin: Revenge was a vitriolic breakup song. Heart was more of a group effort at an accessible song’

++ And what do you remember from the recording sessions for this record? Any anecdotes to share?

Martin, Keith: Revenge and Heart were from two different sessions at Vroom Studio, Watford, with Bob Morledge (his high vocals are in backing vox on Heart)K: We had to finance sessions ourselves, so we were always pushed for time, 8 hours, that was your lot.

++ Tell me about the art for the single sleeve. It looks like a detective to me. What is it about?

Martin, Keith: The subject matter of ‘Revenge’ was a bit dark and the idea I had was to have a sort of film noir style detective, settling a score with gun in hand. Sketched by Martin then finished off by Keith, in a drawing office, while still pretending to do proper work.

++ This record was released on Lost Moment Records. Who were they and how did you end up releasing your record with this label?

Martin: Steve Carter launched Lost Moment records based in Hemel and I heard about label via Nick from The Rattlers, another local band, while I working in a music shop. Nick suggested we submit a demo. Steve liked it and we released the single, 1984.

++ You also appeared on the compilation “Colours of the Bastard Art!” with the song “Jericho”. How did that happen? Did you have any other compilation appearances?

Martin, Keith: Jericho was actually recorded by Spoils! Probably late 1979. We had nothing else suitable to give Steve, he jumped at this and named it SGs. Jericho was recorded at Quest Studio in Luton, engineered by Dave Cook and paid for as ever, by the band.

Keith: I would think that the band name chosen on Colours, ie not Spoils, was not our choice, I doubt we would have done that through choice.

++ Did you record any other songs? Were there any demo tapes perhaps?

Martin, Keith: there’s some stuff on reels somewhere. Masters, such as they were, did not age well, some disintegrated. Original 2 inch reels were re-used in studios as a matter of routine sadly, so what we left with after 8 hours was it.7.5ips copies of these may be about.

++ How come you didn’t get to release any other records?

Martin: Label folded, found deserted premises with empty LP sleeve on the floor. Had to work hard to get our tapes back, which we did eventually do.

++ Was there any interest from the big labels?

Martin, Keith: No

++ What about gigs? Did you play many? Which was the best and the worst and why?

Martin, Keith: played quite a few gigs, but not enough. One or two great ones at small local venues. Bad ones could occupy a whole page and are best forgotten!

++ How was the music press with the Sugar Glyders? Helpful?

Martin: won ‘Demo of the Week’ in Musicians Only magazine. Still have a photocopy of that. Band was chuffed with that. The band was Spoils though.

Keith: Otherwise the doors remained firmly closed.

++ Oh! And where does the name of the band come from?

Martin, Keith: heard the name on a cheap charity record.

++ When and why did you split? Were you involved with music after?

Martin, Keith: never officially split -BOOK US NOW! But seriously folks, we are all still in touch with each other, so that’s nice.

++ What are you up to these days? Any other hobbies aside from music that you enjoy doing?

Martin, Keith: All 3 of us are active in some way, as time and life pressures allow. We’ll all probably play till we drop. I think all three are still music crazed individuals . . . .

++ Looking back, what would you say was the highlight of the Sugar Glyders?

Martin, Keith: Almost certainly having a single in our hands, despite the final lack of response to it, what a moment.

++ So let’s wrap it here, just out of curiosity, if one was to visit your town, your area, what would you suggest checking out, eat or drink?

Martin, Keith: stay away, go somewhere pleasant and green.

++ Anything else you’d like to add?

Martin, Keith: thanks to all for their interest, trying to recall events has raised quite a few memories all round.

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Listen
Sugar Glyders – Free Your Heart

Thanks so much to Paul and Phil for this thorough and amazing interview! Not so long ago I wrote about them on the blog and last week I received some days ago the 7″ release of “Louise”, limited to 20 (!) copies, and it’s such a fabulous song (and the flip-side is also VERY good), that I’m so happy to share with you their answers. If you haven’t heard about Rawhide Chomp before, you are in for a treat!

++ Hi Paul and Phil! Thanks a lot for been keen to answer my questions! I remember I listened to Rawhide Chomp so long ago on Myspace, and I loved the songs there. These days where can one find Rawhide Chomp stuff online?

Paul and Phil: Hi Roque, good to be able to chat at last. I remember being astounded when Phil found out that you’d unearthed the Rawhide Chomp Myspace page and been supportive. Just to know that someone in the USA was interested was amazing! It sent us back to dig out the tapes and eventually kick-started the recent activity.
We’ve just launched a Rawhide Chomp website and a Bandcamp page. Having found the old tapes we just thought it would be good to put the older songs up there and make them available.
http://paul597x.wix.com/rawhide-chomp
https://rawhidechomp.bandcamp.com/album/louise-old-head

++ So, having the website and all, are you planning anything with the band? Maybe some reunion gig? A release? Anything?

Paul: We have just released a very limited 7 inch single of two tracks “Louise “ and “Old Head”. The thing sold out in a day which is something else we didn’t expect. Apologies to anyone who missed it. We are just considering what to do next, whether to cut a few more and make them different or to just keep it as it stands. The recordings are very much of their time, 4 track, in a cold damp room!

As for today and newer tracks we still send songs to each other and are working on finishing a couple more. One is called “Gerla” a tribute to Geoff Duke a British multiple motorcycle Grand Prix Road Racing world champion in the 1950s. Born in St. Helens. As for gigs , you never know.

++ I remember that the bio on Myspace said that you were formed in the mid 80s in St. Helens. Tell me a bit about your town? Never been. What’s there to see or do? And back in the 80s where would you hang out? Were there any good bands in town?

Paul: St.Helens lies between Liverpool and Manchester in the North of England. It is mainly an industrial town, known for its glass making, Rugby League and coal mining. The mid 80s were hard because of the Miners’ Strike and the town was hit hard.

Other than pubs there were no places to hang out. A group of us decided to put on gigs bringing together small bands from the area. We’d negotiate with pub landlords to put events on. Sometimes in small rooms, sometimes in the main bars. We‘d stay for a few weeks or months and then move on to the next. Eventually a kind of scene did start to develop. Thinking back how we got away with it was remarkable. The pub regulars thought we’d come from “Outer Space” and we thought we’d come from New York!

Lots of bands sprung up, mostly guitar based like The Riotous Hues, The Tractors, The Waves, Romulan Cloaking Device and Old Ma Cuxom and ourselves, but there were some other more “synthy” bands like The Tiki Rapids. It’s worth mentioning “Benny Profane” from Liverpool who were really good and always really supportive of us bands “from the sticks”

“The Jactars” from Liverpool were great. Very different from most Liverpool bands.

++ The band was formed from the ashes of of a band called Riotous Hues. Tell me a bit about this band? Were any of you involved with any other bands prior to Rawhide Chomp?

Phil: the Riotous Hues were actually from Rainford, a small village near St Helens. Our singer, Dave Evans lived in Liverpool for a while and got to know Mike Badger, who later formed TheLa’s. We were heavily into The Velvets (especially Live 1969) and Jonathan Richman, but we also loved the melodies of the Pale Fountains and the Beach Boys. I suppose the highlight of our career was playing in Dingwalls in London with some other Liverpool bands. We also appeared on two compilations, ‘A Secret Liverpool’ and Elegance Charm and Deadly Danger. The St. Helens compilation.

Paul: I always looked on “The Hues” as having really well crafted pop songs. Always catchy but somehow off kilter. …….. Phil and Gaz Capper, (our first Drummer) were both in RH. Jamie Flannery a founding member played in an early incarnation of The Tractors and Mike who became our singer played in a band called “Dixie Cartoon”. There was a very open attitude to members of various bands just getting together and coming up with something at least half interesting.. I did something with Andy and Pete from the Tractors, just two lowfi slyly jazzy songs, dead simple but ok. Only performed twice as “The Revolutionary Biscuits of Italy”. Phil jammed with the Tractors for a few weeks. Just trying things out and mixing things up. It was quite a healthy state of affairs with very little rivalry.

++ Who were the members and what instruments did each of you play? How did you all meet?

Paul: Like most bands the line-up fluctuated but the “classic“ was Phil Smith, Guitar, Paul Cross, Guitar, Mike MaCauley, Guitar and vocals, Simon Pratt, Drums and the shaman that was Jaques LeFerve on Bass.

Initially, Jamie and I were working on songs together and we were really lucky when Phil and Gaz were looking for something after the Riotous Hues “split”. We all had similar tastes. We loved making a racket with guitars. None of us could sing and when Mike joined from Dixie Cartoon we felt fairly well set. A band with three guitars. What’s not to like. Mike’s voice has that really natural Northern sound. It’s identical to his speaking voice. Listening now, I love that aspect of the songs.

++ You used to practice at the Fringe offices, right? How was that place?

Paul: It was an office space for an arts organisation. They’d let bands rehearse for free which was really good. Most local bands passed through the doors and also used Dead Fly for demos.

Fringe put out a compilation LP out of some of the local bands including The Riotous Hues, so they helped out in that way too. Check out “Elegance, Charm and Deadly Danger” if you want to get a feel for the bands around nearly 30 years ago. Not all “C86 ish “and a bit variable but a good document of the times.

++ Why the name Rawhide Chomp? Is it because of the dog food?

Paul: Yep! Phil can explain that one!

Phil: The reason is lost in the mists of time- I think I just saw it in a pet shop and like the sound of the words. Plus the song Rawhide by Frankie Laine came into it somewhere.

++ Your first gig was supporting a band called The Tractors at a venue called McDonalds. What do you remember of that first gig? Did it go well?

Phil: it wasn’t a venue, it was actually upstairs in the McDonalds in St.Helens! I have no idea how it was arranged. One of the Tractors probably knew somebody who worked there.

Paul: It went well enough for us to keep going. We played without a bass so we hung it round Ronnies neck. Not sure we were too proficient as a band, but just doing it meant everything in a way. Choosing McDonalds was a bit strange and I’m not sure whose idea it was. Phil and I are vegetarians so I suspect there was a bit of mischief involved. The Tractors were a real conundrum. Chaotic, shambolic, sarcastic, you name it, but great songs and again always supportive of other bands. They’d probably hate me for saying that but it’s true.

++ Then your final gig was supporting The La’s at the Monro in Liverpool. That must have been a big gig? Lots of people? Any anecdotes you could share?

Paul: The Monro was a great place. Bands like Echo and the Bunnymen would turn up and play a set of covers or something. It was just a pub with a back room to play in. Ernie Woo the manager would lock the doors and then produce food for everyone. Fantastic place. Gigs would go on through the night. The La’s gig was great. It was rammed but not a massive place. The early La’s music is underrated, much more stripped and urgent. Mike Badger, was leading the band at the time and he has a true Rock “n” Roll aesthetic. We put their first ever gig on at “The Lamb” in St. Helens and I guess they helped us out in return.

I think we went down pretty well. During one long song Gaz the drummer just got up went to the bar and got a drink, then came back. We just kept going. I’m sure there’s a tape of the gig somewhere.

I went back to The Monro a couple of years ago and it’s now a high end Gastro Pub now. I went in for a pint and got talking to an old boy who remembered it back in the day. Sad really. Something gone from the city’s history.

++ And aside from those two gigs, are there any particular gigs you remember and why?

Paul: Benny Profane at TUC in St.Helens was a big one for us. Good crowd but you couldn’t hear the vocals. Listening to the tape the tunes stand up surprisingly well if a bit linear. I remember thinking no one can her Mike’s vocals and I had to “sing’ the last track A cover of “She Cracked”. I though “Well your gonna hear this one!” That was a mistake, but Phil’s guitar playing is fantastic on it. I wish there were some photos of the night because this guy, George, a sixties veteran did this amazing visual light show, with projections, oil wheels and strobes. It filled the whole hall which was pretty big. I remember turning my back on the crowd and was gobsmacked to see this 20ft projection of Nico coming in and out of focus with acid colours swamping the image. Fantastic. I often wonder what became of George.

I think it’s fair to say that gigs in the town went from the sublime to the ridiculous.

++ Was there any bands you played that you really liked? And which bands would you consider as influences to your music?

Paul: The La’s and Benny Profane were great to play with. We wouldn’t have played with any band we didn’t like or feel some kind of affinity with. We were a bit like that.

Both Phil and I are quite obsessive with music and bands. From slightly earlier, the whole roster of Postcard bands were hugely influential and our love of Jonathan Richman and The Modern Lovers always kept us going. The Velvets were a key touchstone for many of us. Some of those songs, so simple, didn’t always sound completely perfect but so beautiful. I’d inherited a love of Scott Walker from my dad from the and there are a couple of lyrical references to the great man.

++ During those years, the mid 80s, and especially 86 and 87, there was an explosion of guitar pop bands in the UK. So many! Did you feel part of that scene at all? The one they call now C86?

Paul: We were all aware of many of those bands and we really subscribed to that “E A G Now form a band” ethos from the 70s. I really liked The Pastels, The Loft and the Servants. The June Brides too.

I don’t think we felt part of that wider scene in particular but you can see obvious links. Our combined record collections would make a fairly wide reaching record of the times.

Phil: I have just always been obsessed with guitars- The Stones, The Who, The Clash, Velvets, Postcard records, Zoo and Factory Records, the Smiths. Around the time of Rawhide I was collecting Creation Records-they seemed the perfect label for me, with the 60’s influence . We sent Alan McGee a hand painted tape of these songs but it was obviously filed away in his bin.

Paul: It’s probably underneath the Tractors tape.

++ How did the creative process work for you guys?

Paul: Usually, Phil or Myself would come up with a simple chord progression and we’d kick it about. I could come up with a basic tune but often Phil would work out where to go with it. He could come up with complete songs. Initially, I started to write lyrics for the early songs then Mike came in and we’d co write them. It was a real collaborative process and we all got on with it.

Phil: We liked to keep things simple – we had one song called ‘The endless joy of Dm’ which was basically the one chord- Dm all the way through. It was a little influenced by ‘Lonely Street’ by the Loft but I still think it was a great song.

++ I was reading that the amazing song “Louise” will be released as a lathe cut sometime soon. I definitely want to buy a copy of this! It’s such a fabulous song! So I’m wondering what can you tell me about this upcoming release?

Paul: Yeah it’s basically, that’s the single that’s just gone.. It was cut in Manchester each one in real time from the original C15 tape. John the guy who did it had to sort a few “panning” issues but he didn’t mess with it too much. We’re really pleased with it.

There were only 20 available and it was important to add a few small extras to it, including downloads, sorry! Not sure how people got to know about it. Guess that’s the wonder of the internet today.

Phil and I thought long and hard about doing it. Yeah, just digital would have been easy, but we grew up with the excitement going to Liverpool and buying Zoo, Postcard, Factory and early Creation records amongst a million others.

In the end we came to the conclusion that there had to be a physical release and it had to be a 7”. As they say “Small is Beautiful”

I guess you get the same feeling with Cloudberry Records.

++ And if you don’t mind, as this song is so good, what’s the story behind it?

Paul: It’s just about two people with trust issues trying to talk thing out but it ends quite bitterly, and about having to move on. I was also obsessed with Louise Brooks in my younger years. Still am actually. A great actress in some great films.

++ The other song to be included on the 7″ will be “Old Head”. I haven’t heard it yet, but I wonder, was it an easy pick? And if there are many other songs you recorded waiting to be released?

Paul: We have quite a few songs but only three recorded in anything like demo form. Most are just played live. I think some of them still stand up though. I’m sure we could do something with them. “Old Head” is one of our earliest finished songs so we wanted to include it. Again I think Mike’s voice and Phil’s guitar stand out.

++ I think it’s fair to ask, because of how good “Louise” is, how come it didn’t get released in the 80s?

Paul: Neither Phil or I are great at self promotion. We’re quite shy really so getting up on stage was quite a feat. Like most bands we sent tapes off but didn’t really get anywhere. Only “The Tractors” got picked up for a one off release and “Old Ma Cuxom” released a single themselves , I think.

We should have done it ourselves back then, but better late than never.

++ How was the music press and the fanzine people towards Rawhide Chomp, was there good support?

Paul: People really got behind the local bands. I think they really appreciated what we were trying to do. I don’t remember there ever being a big “Punk” scene in St.Helens . So this never had the chance to evolve in to what came next. Most of us had to go to Liverpool or Manchester to see bands we liked, so a group of tyro bands trying to do it locally was viewed as quite exciting. There was a “Buzz” about the town with frequent gigs in small pubs. Stuff that wasn’t “Pub”rock or just covers.

We raised a few eyebrows which is always a good thing. There wasn’t a fanzine culture in town and only “The Tractors” got a piece in the NME. It was a good one though.

++ So why did you split? And what did you all do after? Were you in bands?

Paul: We all had to hold down jobs and it was quite tough going. Phil and I went on to be teachers and moved away. We’re really not sure where Mike is now. We are desperately trying to find him if only to give him a record. Same for Simon. Gaz became a train driver, A dream come true!

++ It was in 2008 when I read on Myspace that you were back together. How did all that work out? Are you still planning to play and record new music?

Paul: Phil and I still share songs as we said and hopefully we’ll find a bit of time to finish something off. It’s ok doing the Dropbox thing but we really miss that all in a room bouncing ideas about vibe. We meet up a few times each year to see bands and have a few beers.

++ Aside from music on what other things do you spend your time on?

Paul: by its nature work takes up a lot of time. Here in Sheffield there are some great artists and musicians so I get to gigs quite frequently.
Having done “Louise“ with Rawhide we’d really like to release some of the other songs. Also we wouldn’t mind releasing other bands as limited editions. See how we go.

++ And just out of curiosity, if I was a tourist in St. Helens, what’s there to see, eat or do?

Well it’s changed a great deal. Definitely go to a Saints Rugby League match (It’s like a speeded up American Football), Track down a Pimbletts Pie, still the best in the world and take the train to Liverpool for a stroll by the River Mersey. Karl Jung called it “The Pool of Life”.

If you’re really lucky you might catch “Tenements” playing or “Michael Head and the Red Elastic Band”

++ Thanks, let’s wrap it here, anything else you’d like to add?

Thanks for the interest.

It’s been great to think about what happened and put some kind of perspective on a very small footnote from the “80s. It’s really interesting to draw a line from those times to what a label like “Cloudberry” is doing today.

We’ll definitely check it out more.
Cheers Paul and Phil.

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Listen
Rawhide Chomp – Louise

Thanks a lot to Sebastian Voß for the interview! The Grindcore Poppies didn’t release anything but two amazing songs on an indiepop compilation called “A View of Our Dreams” on a Serbian label. The songs were so good so I blogged about them some weeks ago. Then Sebastian got in touch and was willing to tell the story of the band! So here it is!

++ Hi Sebastian! Thanks so much for your time. I always liked those two tracks of Grindcore Poppies on the “A View of Our Dreams” compilation, so it’s really awesome that we can talk! So how are you? Are you making music these days??

Hej, Roque, I’m fine, thank you. And I’m so incredibly overwhelmed by your interest in my music due to the fact that lots of time have passed since „A View To Our Dreams“. Currently I’m still playing bass and drums in a Low-fi-band called Lancaster which sounds a little bit like Pavement, The Wedding Present and early Pastels. Provided that I find enough time I still do some homerecording. If you like, check „The Fisherman And His Soul“ at Soundcloud.

++  I always wondered, how come a German band ended up on an indiepop compilation in Serbia? How did that come about?

At the end of the nineties – when digital music was in its infancy – I would upload some of my Grindcore Poppies-tracks at mp3.com. Once upon a time, Nik and Ana from Belgrade ,who were passionate Indiepopfans and genre connaisseurs, wrote me a mail and told me about their compilation plans. They also told me that they found my songs by pure chance and then they would play „This Light Will Always Shine“ at an Indieclub venue two or three times and made it a little „hit” in Belgrade. On this occasion they asked if they could take one or two of my songs for their compilation. Because of being part of such an illustrious selection of fantastic bands and musicians it’s needless to say that I still feel quite honoured.

++ And those two songs that were on that comp, “This Light Will Always Shine” and “French Cars”, if you don’t mind, what’s the story behind them?

++ Let’s go back in time, what was the first band you were involved with? And which other bands aside from Grindcore Poppies you’ve been in?

++ When and how did Grindcore Poppies came about? Who were the members and how did you know each other?

Grindcore Poppies was always a home recording project. First quantum leap was the use of a TASCAM-Portastudio and a drum computer in the middle of the nineties. In this time „This time..“ was made as a classical bed room recording in my shared apartment. Two years later – together with a friend of mine, Sebastian Haass, who is a truly gifted singer and drummer and who had a rehearsal room and a digital 8-track-mixer –  I recorded a couple of more songs that I’ve stockpiled the years before. The style would slowly change into a more serious and mature kind of songwriting. I think ten years ago Sebastian had moved back to his hometown Bamberg in Franconia, which is located about 500 km away from here, so we enforcedly stopped recording together.

++ And why the name? Who came up with it? It’s so good!

Haha, that name was sheer interesting and funny sounding non-sense!

++ There was another song on Soundcloud called “Fallacious Falling Star”. This one is dedicated to Paddy MacAloon. So I wonder who were your influences and what are your favourite indiepop bands from all time?

If I was allowed to name but a few bands and influences I would say Prefab Sprout, The Wedding Present, BMX Bandits and other C86 bands. Some of my favorite indie labels were Creation, Postcard, Sarah, Firestation Tower, Flying Nun.

++ So you are based in Münster, right? How was that place at the time of the Grindcore Poppies? Has it changed much?

++ Were there any other like-minded bands in town that you like?

It’s always been kind of a collective or a network I’ve been engaged with. Currently, I would like to recommend Them Cities, Elektrogrill, The Green Apple Sea, Bersarin Quartett.

++ And in general, in Germany, what have been your favourite guitar pop bands all-time?

My favourite German guitar pop bands are Blumfeld, Sharon Stoned, The Notwist, Goldstoned, Busch, Die Zimmermänner… and I could name more and more.

++ Aside from these three songs that we’ve mentioned, are there any more Grindcore Poppies recordings at all?

About more than twenty songs, I guess, but they are yet unreleased…

++ How did the creative process work for you? What do you remember from the recording sessions for the Grindcore Poppies songs?

++ Oh! And did you ever considered making indiepop in German?

Not really…

++ Have you appeared on any other compilations?

Well, I took part on certain compilations and mixtapes as free giveaways.

++ And how come there was never a proper release for the band?

This is a good question. I don’t really know. I think that I was too shy, probably. But I really would have had released a 7’’.

++ What about gigs? Did you play many with the band? If so which were your favourite gigs and why?

There was no real Grindcore Poppies gig, but I played some of my songs with other bands. From 2002 to 2010 I played in a band called Stars Of Track And Field, later we changed the name to Stars Play Music. We played a small tour supporting Indiepop heroes „Slut“ from Ingolstadt promoting our album „Distance Is Necessary“ in 2008. Three gigs in a row in Cologne, Hamburg and Berlin, each gig with more than 500 people in the audience. That was a great experience and it was big fun.

++ When and why did the band split? What did you do after?

There were (and are) lots of other bands and projects with the Gleis 22 collective like The Delicious, Stars Play Music, Lancaster and Them Cities. At the moment I play some Grindcore Poppies songs together with two friends of mine in our rehearsal room. It works – and it’s great! Well, maybe this will be the beginning of a glorious return 😉 !

++ And aside from music what other hobbies do you like?

Other hobbies aside from music, are you kidding 😉 ? Well, since I’m ten years old I’ve passionately collected records. I am fascinated by discovering new stuff and back-catalogues. Except this I like hiking and cooking. And – last but not least – I have a little daughter who is nearly two years old. It’s such great fun playing with her and showing her how everything works around us. And I really like my job as a consultant medical doctor in a psychotherapeutical day care unit.

++ Tell me a bit about Münster. I was there many years ago for a day, but didn’t get someone to point me out what was the best to do there. So tell me, what are the sights that no one should miss? and what about the traditional dish from your town?

Well, it’s great to hear that you were in Münster as well and I hope that you had a good impression! Meanwhile I moved to a small village in the affluent area but as I’m working in Münster every day I still appreciate this town very much. It’s a large modern city and its clear medieval structure, a varied selection of cultural and academical offerings and – last but not least – the beautiful countryside around makes living here worthwhile. Concerning traditional dishes… ummm- you need to be an omnivore, I think. Westphalian dishes are well known for their rural and „hearty“ preparations of various meat products, ham and sausages. F.e. you could taste “Münsterländer Töttchen” (if you dare).

++ And I always ask this to German bands, what’s your favourite beer? and football team?

Personally, i mostly like cool and sharp Pilsener, my favourite brand is „Jever“ wich is brewed near the Northern Sea in Ostfriesland. Concerning football I cheer on VfB Stuttgart (which causes any true joy at the moment).

++ So let’s wrap it here, thanks again! Anything else you’d like to add?

It was a pleasure! Thank you and I wish you all the best!

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Listen
Grindcore Poppies – This Light Will Always Shine

Thanks so much to Kieron Flaherty for the interview! I wrote just some weeks ago about the New Zealand band Perfect Garden, on how much I was loving their sound and how surprised I was that this band was so obscure when it deserved to be well known! Anyhow, Kieron got in touch and was very kind to share more songs with me. And how good were they! Now he tells me the story about the band, so read and you’ll fall in love with this band!

++ Hi Kieron! Thanks so much for getting in touch with me. Really loved the songs from Perfect Garden! They are so good! So let me ask you, are you still making music?

Hi Roque! Thanks for your interest and support. To answer your first question – I’m afraid not! I do have a battered old acoustic lying round the house that I use from time to time but certainly nothing serious and I haven’t been in a band for a LONG time…!

++ On the comment you left me on the blog, you say you hero-worshipped Bobby Gillespie. What were your favourite songs of him, and what do you think of the sound that eventually Primal Scream would have, leaving the jangly guitars behind. Were you still a fan then?

When it comes to my favourite songs by (early!) Primal Scream it’s hard to know where to start. I absolutely loved that band until Jim Beattie and Martin St John left. My absolute favourite is Black Star Carnival (b-side to Gentle Tuesday – nice and obscure!) Then we are on to It Happens, All Fall Down, May the sun shine bright for you, Bewitched and Bewildered, Gentle Tuesday, Tomorrow ends today, Velocity Girl, Treasure trip… I mean where do you end?! I do remember being given a tape of the Peel sessions by a friend who had been to England and taped it and for a while it was my most treasured possession.
As for their new sound… well let’s just say I’m not a fan.  I bought into the 2^nd album and loved Ivy Ivy Ivy and some other tracks but it’s just the sense of betrayal I feel is too much for me to listen to them much these days. It’s more the fact that they left all the original fans behind and kinda laughed at them that really annoyed me. I saw them in ‘94 and sure it was fine and dandy but to not play any of the earlier material is a massive insult to the original fans. To be fair though I did meet Mr Gillespie in London a few years back and he was very friendly and talkative. I asked him if they would ever play the old classics live again… but he was very non-committal! He did sign my All Fall Down and Crystal Crescent singles though so fair play to him I suppose. I could rant about Primal Scream all day so I should leave it there…!

++ You were telling me that back then, when you were in Perfect Garden you were into the C86 scene. Are you still listening to this sort of sound? And what were/are your favourite C86 bands ever?

As with everyone as I’ve got older my music taste has diversified but to be honest I do still listen to a lot of jangly pop. I mean the Smiths and early Primals are never far away from my music player.
My favourite C86 bands? Well I loved Jesse Garon and the Desperadoes (still do of course!) They were just the perfect coming together of the scene for me. I loved lots of Scottish bands unsurprisingly… the Soup Dragons, The Shop Assistants, The Close Lobsters, The Pastels. Then there was Talulah Gosh, the Wedding Present, the Bodines, the Mighty Lemon Drops, Razorcuts, The Chesterfields, The Pooh Sticks…I could go on and on!

++ You were based in Dunedin. There was the whole Dunedin Sound too. How did that influence you? Did you feel part of it?

To be honest we didn’t really feel part of that scene at all. Most of those bands were a lot older than us and The Clean and The Chills had already moved on. I think it probably peaked around 85/86 and we were all just in school and not old enough to quite be taking it in. I did have an older brother with a great record collection who would bring those records home but I was more interested in what was happening in England to be honest. The band that did really happen when I was old enough to be going out were the Straightjacket Fits who were one of the greatest live bands I had/have ever seen.

++ And why do you think such an amazing explosion of bands appeared during that time in New Zealand? And that actually became quite well known! Like if you see, for example, there was a bunch of great Australian bands at the time but they are way more obscure! I’ve often wondered about this…

That is the million dollar question… and people in Dunedin are still asking it themselves I think! I think that being a student town had a big bearing on it. Also its isolation from the rest of the world meant that bands were able to develop and make their own music without a heavily critical music press breathing down their necks. To be honest I’m still kinda baffled by it all! I’m pretty proud that the Clean, The Bats, The Chills etc. are still mentioned as influences on loads of younger bands -especially coming from the States it seems.

++ Tell me a bit about the town, what were your favourite venues, what were the places you used to hang out?

There was certainly nothing glamourous about Dunedin when we grew up – it’s a much nicer place now – coffee shops on every corner! In the 80s it was mostly working men’s pubs – all a bit rough around the edges. Our favourite hangout was the Empire tavern or the Robbie Burns hotel. The Empire was the place to go see up and coming bands and we certainly played there a few times. I had many great nights there but alas I believe it’s not there anymore. The Captain Cook was another popular venue but that was more in the student part of town and we didn’t venture there too often. Dunedin is a pretty small place so it was easy to wander down George Street (the main street) and go to many different pubs on any given night.

++ How did Perfect Garden start as a band? How did you all meet?

Well me and Shane had been talking about starting a band for a while. We were really in love with the Primitives so we wanted a female singer. I was dating Karen at the time so we asked her if she fancied trying out and she turned out to be great. We had another drummer to start off with but he wanted to play guitar so we asked Aaron if he fancied joining and he did. Martin was someone we knew from another local band who looked good so he was in. I think the rule was you had to own a pair of winkle pickers and a black polo neck to be in the band!

++ Have you all been involved in bands before?

Yes – to a certain extent. Aaron and I were in a band called The Living End for a short time. I seem to remember Shane played stand up drums at one of our gigs… all very Mary Chain of course! Martin was in a couple of bands before we meet. It was all very chaotic of course – amazing that it ever came together to be honest!

++ Where does the name of the band come from?

To be honest it came from a mis-hearing down the phone! As with most bands the hardest bit is choosing a name-writing songs is easy compared to that! Anyway we were putting ideas around – I seem to remember ‘The Chain of Flowers’ as an idea after a line in Birthday by the Sugarcubes. I had heard that the name of the House of Love was from an underground erotic novel (A Spy in the House of Love by Anais Nin) so I asked around if anyway had heard of other names in this genre. I was talking to a friend who suggested ‘The Perfumed Garden’ – however I heard – ‘The ‘Perfect’ Garden’ and thought – brilliant! So there you have it – we should have been The Perfumed Garden – although I think either name would have been fine.

++ As I was saying, I loved all the songs I’ve heard. So do tell me how was the creative process for you guys? How did it work?

Most of the songs were worked out in the practice room. I don’t remember any of them being written fully formed – although I may be wrong. Mostly it would be a riff or a bassline that we would work on. The lyrics would normally be written by either Shane or Karen although I did contribute a few. We really were like magpies – taking influences from the bands we loved and turning them into our own songs. Looking back it’s hard to imagine that we ever came up with those tracks that sound quite individual but I’m sure most bands feel like this.

++ You were around only for around two years but I’ve seen you played many gigs including some with The Bats, is that right? What were your favourite gigs and why? Any anecdotes you could share?

Yeah we were quite lucky to score some really good support slots early on. This was mostly due to me being lucky enough to work at the local HMV shop which was populated with loads of people in Flying Nun bands! We had members of Look Blue Go Purple, The Bats, 3 Ds, Dead C – it was a hipsters paradise looking back. Anyway I got to know Rob Scott from the Bats who very graciously offered us a support slot with them. It was quite a thrill playing that gig but pretty nerve-wracking. I seem to remember my guitar string breaking and taking ages to put another one on and tune it! Anyway it seemed to go really well – no matter what that reviewer thought on the youtube video! We never got to the stage of headlining – always support. We played with the 3’ds a couple of times which was great – they were really nice as well. We had close ties to a couple of bands in Christchurch – Black Spring and Dolphin and so we did a few’ triple-headers’ with them-both in Dunedin and Christchurch. I have some memories of playing a charity gig at Sammys which was the largest venue in Dunedin. I remember playing Into the Ground and actually looking up from my guitar (I didn’t do that often!) and seeing people getting really into it… that was quite a thrill.

++ From what I know there was one tape released with four songs. “Into the Ground”, “End of the Perfect Sunshine”, “Amelia” and “Swirl”. Would you mind telling me the story behind these fantastic songs?

Well let me just say thank you for calling the songs fantastic – it means a lot after all these years! We never did get around to actually releasing the songs but I’ll get into that in the next question.

As for the songs – well this is how I remember it.

Into the Ground. Me and Shane were listening to a lot of Loop , Spacemen 3 and Ultra Vivid Scene (the Mercy seat was a real favourite) at the time and loved the idea of a long ‘droney’ song. It’s also a lot easier to play this type of riff when you are learning how to play-especially if you turn the distortion up! The original version went for over 6 minutes – I loved the idea of locking into a groove and just keeping it going.

End of the Perfect Sunshine. To me the best song we ever did. It came about from a bassline that Martin was messing about with. The guitar lines just followed it but where the big drum intro into the chorus was just one of those magical things that happen in practice rooms. I can say for sure that the chords for the chorus are the same as About You by the Mary Chain… I was very pleased to come up with that. Shane wrote the lyrics and I recall thinking…’this sounds like an indie classic’!

Amelia. This was built around a little riff I had from listening to The Bitter End from Felts wonderful Pictorial Jackson Review. I’m pretty sure the name of the song is a tribute to the wonderful Amelia Fletcher from Talulah Gosh. The lyrics were written by Karen and tell a tale of jealousy at a lover being fancied by another girl – and it causing considerable pain it seems.

Swirl. This one I remember the least. I think we just wanted a good thrashy song to play and worked out a pretty simple riff which Shane wailed all over. Im guessing we had probably heard the early Ride e.ps and were trying for something along those lines…

++ Was this tape a demo? Or was it a proper release? Where was it sold and how many copies were made?

The tape was a demo. Not long after we recorded these songs the band broke up as Shane headed to England. Subsequently what you see in the video is a mock up made by Karen and not a proper release. So I can safely say – none were made and none were sold!

++ On the tape it says it was mastered by Kevin Stokes for Failsafe Records. Was that your label?

We were never signed to anyone I’m afraid. Kevin was in a great band called Dolphin from Christchurch who we got to know through our friends in Black Spring who were also from Christchurch. Subsequently we did some recording in their studio which is where the songs you have heard were done. As an aside I remember writing to Sarah records around mid ‘89 just to tell them how much I was enjoying the music coming out on the label and I was thrilled to hear back from Matt and Clair a few weeks later. They were really interested that people in NZ were loving their label. Anyway I promised to send them our recordings but for some reason I didn’t do it…

++ And what do you remember from those recording sessions?

Not that much to be honest! Maybe we knew the band was coming to an end I’m not sure but I’m glad we got the songs down before we broke up. My main memories are trying to play the lead for Into the Ground (based on the solo at the end of Velocity Girl – although it may be hard to hear that!) and Kevin suggesting the wonderful backing vocals for End of the Perfect Sunshine which to me really make the song. When we heard that played back for the first time there were goosebumps for sure! As you can imagine it was done very quickly. All four songs were done in a day – recording doesn’t come cheap so we had to really hurry it along but I think we really managed to capture the band and what we were trying to do at the time.

++ Are there any more recordings by the band?

Yeah, just two. As mentioned earlier a longer version of Into the Ground and a lovely little pop song called Back for More – one of our very earliest tracks. They were recorded in Dunedin at the Radio One (Student Radio) recording studio – (no idea if it’s still there!) These two tracks got some play on Student Radio and I believe Into the Ground made No 1 in the Top 11 for a couple of weeks… so that was really pleasing looking back (thanks Aaron I had forgotten that!)

++ There’s one flyer of yours I saw that says “Indiepop Ain’t Noise Pollution!”. I wonder then if there were many indiepop fans in New Zealand at the time? And how did you find out about indiepop? How did you get into?

Well there were certainly a few fans and of course we all knew each other – Dunedin is a pretty small place as you can imagine – it’s easy to spot a fan of indie pop. I got into it, like many people I suspect, through loving the big two – the Smiths and the Mary Chain. Again being lucky to have an older brother who not only had a great record collection but also bought the NME from time to time (it wasn’t easy to get in N.Z in those days – and it was 3 months behind) made it possible for me to read about these amazing looking bands coming out of the U.K. If I saw a picture of a band with bowl cuts and leather trousers I wanted to buy their records! I also had met Shane who also had a big collection and a job which meant he was able to buy all the expensive imports of the day as a lot of these bands L.P’s were hard to come by in Dunedin at the time. From ‘86 onwards we were just lapping up everything to do with that scene. We devoured the music press and would buy anything mentioned, especially if it was on Creation. I also had a friend who went to England quite regularly and would bring back tapes of John Peel sessions and videos of the chart show so that was another way we got to know what was happening. Of course the greatest day was actually getting a copy of the actual C86 tape. I think it was a copy of a copy but boy did I treasure it… and play it a LOT!!

++ Perhaps you were big indiepop record collectors too?

Well as I said earlier Shane had an amazing collection when I met him as, being a little older than me he had left school and was working. I had a paper-run so I was able to afford an album a week… but it soon added up! Karen started to get really into as well and sometimes we would all be fighting at Echo Records (the best place in town for indie pop from England at the time) for the latest imports! I know Aaron was into the Sex Pistols in a big way and Martin was a big fan of 4ad (amongst other things) so all of these influences were bought to the table.

++ And was there any interest from labels to release your music? It’s hard for me to believe no one put your songs on vinyl!

Unfortunately not because as I say we broke up not long after we did them. I think the fire was perhaps going out of the band and I guess we knew Shane was leaving for England so looking back I don’t think there was any plans to put them out. I’m just so glad we managed to get something recorded that still sounds really good after all this time…

++ How was the press in New Zealand towards Perfect Garden? Was there good support? What about fanzines?

We did a few interviews with a couple of local fanzines and the local Dunedin papers. It was all very positive I seem to remember. Of course I was always waiting for the call from the NME that never came…!

++ Then what happened? When and why did you split?

It all comes back to Shane leaving for England I guess. I think we talked about carrying on and I’m sure we even tried another guitarist but it seems the fire just went out pretty quickly. It was about the middle of 1990 and as I say things were changing in England and indie pop was yesterday’s news and perhaps it felt like the band had had its day. I don’t think we ever had a band conversation about splitting up… I think we just all drifted away.

++ Did you all kept making music afterwards? Are you all still in touch?

Through the wonders of the internet and Facebook we are, to a point, all in touch. We are all spread across the Globe now- I’m in the U.K, Aaron is in N.Z, Karen is in Australia, Shane is in Canada and Martin is in Denmark so as I said – a reunion is unlikely! Aaron still plays in bands but I don’t think anyone else does – unless playing guitar to amuse my 6 year old counts!

++ And these days, what are you up to? What other hobbies do you like doing?

Well after many years living in London and going to see every band under the sun I prefer a quieter life in Cambridge these days with my partner and 6 year old son. I keep fit, watch films, drink coffee… and still play Sonic Flower Groove way too much!

++ Looking back, what would you say was the biggest highlight of Perfect Garden?

I guess the times I really enjoyed were being in the practice room and getting songs together. Anyone who has been in bands will know that thrill of a skeleton of an idea blossoming into a fully fledged song. I remember how fantastic to was to get End of the Perfect Sunshine together – me and Aaron would grin like idiots at each other as we built into the chorus – almost as if to say ‘did we really write THIS?!’ It’s those times I really miss – even to this day…

++ I’ve never been to New Zealand, though I hope I go one day. So if you don’t mind, what do you recommend me visiting in your town? And what about any traditional dishes that I shouldn’t miss?

If you ever visit Dunedin you MUST try the ‘cheese rolls’… they are legendary. As I say I don’t live there anymore but when I visit they are the first things I go for… along with Jimmy’s Pies! They are incredibly delicious. Dunedin is a pretty small but lively place as it’s a student town and I’m guessing as a fan of Flying Nun from the States it would be great to see all the places the bands played? So I would recommend visiting the Empire (not sure if it’s still open though!), The Captain Cook, The Oriental… legendary venues. Then it would be also worth venturing out of Dunedin to Central Otago to visit Wanaka and Queenstown which are stunningly beautiful!

++ Let’s wrap it here Kieron, thanks so much again, anything else you’d like to add?

I’d just like to say thanks to you for your interest! It’s been great trawling through my memories of a very short lived but really important part of my life. We had some fantastic times and wrote and played music that we couldn’t have expected to make when we started the band. We went from being slightly shambolic to a pretty tight unit in a relatively short space of time and I’m really proud of that. We also managed to write some pretty wonderful songs I think! On that note I’m going to post the rest of the songs online in the next few weeks.
Edit: here are all the songs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A3C-jfbZ1e0&list=PLXAFG5whX2leDFhgR9Pg1LXhh9GYnMj0k

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Listen
Perfect Garden – End of the Perfect Sunshine

Thanks so much to Mark Walshe for this interview! Some time ago I wrote about Some Other Day in the blog, I was in love with their songs and hoped to get in touch with the members of the band just to know a little bit more about them. Happily Mark got in touch not too long ago and was keen to answer all my questions! Hope you enjoy it!

++ Hi Mark! Thanks so much for getting in touch! I think you are living in the US these days, isn’t that right? How come you ended up here?

I moved to the U.S in 1993. I had been living in various parts of London and working seven days a week on a clothes stall in Camden Town. The Tender Trap had just come to an end and I was in need of a break. My older brother Ed lived in San Francisco so I thought I’d pay him a visit. It was only supposed to be for two months but that plan got slightly extended thanks to Ed’s invitation for me to use his couch for as long I wanted. Staying for a while seemed to be a very attractive proposition. Now it’s 23 years later.

++ Have you been involved a lot with music in the US?

When I first arrived it was just about me playing my acoustic in people’s living rooms. I wrote a lot back then. It must have been the effect of a new environment. I met a guy called Lonnie Lazar from Texas and we’d play gigs together in a cafe/bar called Simple Pleasures. He would play his bluesy, country gig and I follow him with my Essex chops. Quite a varied evening!

I also got involved in a ramshackle nightclub called Nickie’s where Ed and myself would host a weekly Irish night. We knew a fair bit about Irish music because of our parents. I would book some amazing artists and we became friends with most of them. That night became a platform for me to play my songs too. We called the night “An Choirm Cheoil”. I suppose you could say they were the golden years in SF.

In 1998 I slaved over an eight-song demo (imaginatively entitled “8 Songs”) that I recorded on an old four-tack Tascam studio in my bedroom. I upgraded to a digital Boss BR-8 but it was all still pretty lo-fi. Around then I started playing regularly in a bar called The Edinburgh Castle. It was a really bohemian joint full of musicians and writers. Irvine Welsh was a friend of the manager and a frequent contributor to the reading nights. I also met Patrick McCabe and James Kelman in there. I got together with a great gang of musicians from that bar and we’ve been in cover bands together ever since. All great musicians from Scotland, New York, and Ireland. It was a very fortunate meeting.

++ So I wrote many years ago about Some Other Day on my blog, as all the songs I had heard from your band were excellent. There was very little information about the band online, so I hope you can help me fill in the blanks. Let’s start by the obvious, who were Some Other Day and how did you all meet?

The band started with Suzy Allen and myself. She had moved to Harlow from Brighton (originally) and we met in The Square around 1985. A friend of Suzy’s had given us this ancient reel-to-reel machine that we somehow managed to breath life into. It was like a prop from a Science Fiction film. We both had some songs so we started to record. Richard Martin came along with some much needed bass lines and we entered ourselves into the Harlow Rock Contest. There seemed to be endless rock contests in the town back then. We had intended to play without a drummer but with just weeks to go before the gig, Billy Dawkins turned up with his big drum sound and the band was complete. After our first rehearsal I remember thinking, “How were we going to do this without those drums?”

++ I know you were involved with many bands back in the day like Dark Horse, The Clinic, and Tender Trap. What would be the order chronologically for them, and if you can in a line or two tell me what sort of sound, or what influences, did each band had. Were they very different to Some Other Day?

That’s a big question but one I’m pleased to answer. You may need to heavily edit here because there’s no short way of telling this.

Dark Horse was first. The germ of an idea that started back in 1977 when I met my best mate Paul Howard in school. We bonded over a mutual interest in all things punk rock. After making a lovely racket throughout our school years we finally got serious about the band around 1982. Keith Brown was like a child prodigy drummer who we met through school friends. He was about three years younger than us and we’d never let him forget it, “Don’t worry Keith, rock and roll is a big bad world but we’ll look after you. We’re old hands at this”. We would rehearse in a local church near my house. The priest gave me the keys and just told us not to break anything. Father Lubey, what a hero. There was a metal work training shop directly opposite with the constant clang of hammer against anvil. In the summertime, when we had to open the church doors the metalwork training shop complained to the priest about our noise. I always love telling that story.

Our influences at that time were bands like The Cure, The Stranglers, U2 and The Bunnymen. Also Scott Walker, Marc & The Mamba’s and Bowie were very big for Paul especially. We wrote individually and the songs were called things like, “What It Is To Be Young”, “Now And Forever”, “Better Off Dead”, “Live Another Day”, “The Question” and “The Underground”. Quite advanced for schoolboys! Paul was very quiet about his talents back then. He insisted that he would never sing even backing vocals. Funny, considering what a great vocalist he became.

The Clinic was another band formed with schoolmates. I handed my friend Paul Carolan a tape of “Faith” by The Cure when we were in the fifth form. He kept going on about Earth Wind and Fire but I knew he couldn’t possibly be that cheerful. After Dark Horse split up I got together with Paul, his brother James on bass and Joe Quill on drums. Every Saturday, Joe and myself would take the bus from Harlow to Loughton and rehearse in the Carolan’s front living room. A petition was set up in the area to get us to stop. I think it just made us turn up a notch. Paul sang and wrote all the songs and they were dark, ethereal and lovely. “Our Day Out” was our anthem. Well, so was, “Spinning Room” and “Hero” actually. Paul clearly had the anthem thing down. I loved his songs. I discovered the Boss Chorus pedal around about then and I used it like an oxygen mask. The Cure were a big influence but so too were Theatre Of Hate, Joy Division and The Cocteau Twins. We were Goth Casual! We had mates in a band called Under Two Flags and they were really making it so I think they were on our minds a fair bit.

We played The Tom Allen Centre in Stratford one night supporting The Jazz Butcher. He came into our dressing room and asked us to go on tour with them right there and then. He was very insistent but I had to turn him down because James was moving to Sheffield. He told me to get a new bass player but I told him we were family. That was our last gig.

Some Other Day I was able to get back to writing songs in Some Other Day. I wrote most of them but Suzy wrote some crackers for the band too. I wrote loads of songs in SOD. I think it had something to do with that naivety of youth where you think you can’t go wrong. Actually, you can. I wrote some real stinkers too but because I was writing so much, hopefully the pro’s outweighed the cons.

The Tender Trap Around 1985 Paul Howard suddenly announced that his band The Tender Trap were going to play in the Harlow Rock Contest and that he was going to be the lead singer. This was a surprise to everyone because, as active as he was with music, nobody had heard so much as a peep out of the man on a microphone. I’ll never forget that gig. It was just four songs but it was the first time even I’d heard that incredible voice. Me, his brother in Punk! The next year he reformed The Tender Trap with Simon Lomond from The Neurotics on drums and Andy McDonald from The Pressure on bass. I was flattered to be asked to join as the lead guitarist but I wasn’t confident. I never really saw myself in that role but in The Trap, like in The Clinic I suppose, I could hear what my friends wanted in their songs. The Tender Trap proper was formed and we lived somewhere in between The Clash, The Waterboys, Dexy’s and Little Richard. We supported The Pogues, Hazel O’Connor, Geno Washington, The Blow Monkey’s, The Energy Orchard, The Liberty Cage, Sam Brown and even did a gig at Glastonbury. We were a giddy gang of pirates (The Libertines would’ve blushed) and we should’ve gone much further than we did. It was just another classic “bastard record company” story. I’ll leave it at that.

++ Where does the name Some Other Day come from?

I saw a 4AD advert in the NME. It listed all their coming releases and underneath, in a typically understated 4AD way it read “some other day…” in tiny italics. I thought it was poetic, like how we all live our lives. Some other day I’ll be happy, fulfill that ambition. Some other day I’ll fall in love.

++ How was the creative process for the band?

I remember it as very democratic. We’d rehearse every Thursday night in a place called Parndon Mill on the outskirts of Harlow. It was an actual Mill, an ancient drafty thing but also strangely comfortable. We’d play like crazy for about two hours suggesting politely to each other “Do it a bit more like this”. Then I’d give Billy the nod and we’d all go to the pub for a break or, “to write the set-list” as we’d sell it. When we got back Billy would start up some mad drumbeat and we’d usually have the bare bones of a song to go home with. I remember a jam like that ending up as a song called “Joy”. Billy was bashing the blazes out of his kit and I played a kind of a Will Sergeant riff to Richard’s plodding JJ Burnell bass line. The tape machine was running and I was really excited with the results. I wrote the song very quickly around that. It just made me understand that not all songs have to begin in your bedroom with an acoustic guitar.

++ And at that time, which bands did you follow? What were you into?

A big album at our inception was “Swoon” by Prefab Sprout. Now I’m not saying we reached anything like their texture and intensity but we definitely loved that record. I remember thinking Del Amitri’s self-titled first album was unmatchable and very different form their second incarnation. It’s hard to escape The Smiths in all this. That band had more of an influence on me than I’d like to admit. It was a big time for those chimey guitars ala Johnny Marr and I embraced it to say the very least. Ben Watt’s “North Marine Drive” was my bible back then. Richard was a huge Prince fan. Billy would rave about Talk Talk. Suzy was brought up with a great Folk mentality. I’m from an Irish family so I was very into those gorgeous, melancholic melodies. Christy Moore changed me considerably. There was a band called The Woodentops who we stumbled upon at Brighton’s ‘Zap Club’ and collectively fell for. They married great tunes and big beats. I heard Nicky Wire say something to the effect recently that if you were lucky enough to have been brought up on bands like Buzzcocks and The Clash, then they will always inform your music in some way. I think that’s very true. In that way, Echo and The Bunnymen were ever present for me. “Heaven Up Here” is still one of my favourite albums.

++ You didn’t have a proper release. Why’s that? Was there any interest from labels? It’s surprising as your songs are so good!

We had a few visits up to London to talk to record companies but it was all a bit “Hmm, nice, see you in a year”. There’s a funny story about how we drew attention to our tape but I’ll save that for later.

++ You did appear on two compilations. “Bury Your Sins” appeared on the “Not Just Mandela” comp with a bunch of well known bands like Housemartins or Billy Bragg. This compilation had a political background. Who asked you to contribute? And was there a gig to promote it? What do you remember about this episode of Some Other Day?

Davy Lamp Records was the brainchild of Graham Bell and Steve Lamacq. It was originally set up to help the miners with the fall-out from the strike of ‘84-5. The “Not Just Mandela” album was an ambitious project to bring together loads of Harlow bands and release a record to help the Anti Apartheid Movement in South Africa. Billy Bragg was well known to The Neurotics and Attila The Stockbroker as they’d all toured extensively in Eastern Europe. I’m not too sure how The Housemartins were reached. Probably Attila. The man was and is a gigging machine. The album was about to be pressed and we weren’t on it. All my mates were there but we weren’t on the list! We played a gig at Harlow Town Park one summer and Graham walked up to me when I got off stage and asked me if I wanted to contribute. I was chuffed. I wrote “Bury Your Sins” especially for that I think.

++ The other appearance was with the song “Sad But True” on the compilation”Uncle Arthur’s Pop Parlour” were a bunch of indie guitar bands appeared. How did you end up in this compilation? And did you feel at the time that there was a like-minded scene with all these guitar pop bands?

I didn’t know much about this compilation at the time. Gareth Stevens was a good friend of ours. He was a local journalist and champion of the band. I think that compilation was his baby. I suppose there was a like-minded scene. What was nice about it though, in those days, there was no one band copying another. There was a bit of borrowing but individuality won the day.

++ Then I was lucky to hear more songs on the Harlow Archive. 4 songs that are just so good. My first question of course is, are there any more recordings?

We recorded three demos. One was recorded in Hertford and two others at an amazing studio in South London called RMS. It was directly opposite Selhurst Park Football ground. The studio owner Andy was so clued into what we were trying to achieve. He really liked our band and I felt we were in great hands. We recorded “Bury Your Sins” and “One Man’s Words” in there and then went back to record a four-track session intended for vinyl release. We just ran out of cash and it became a tape. That had “Head Still Full Of You”, “All Water Under The Bridge”, “It Stays With Me Always” and “Midnight” on it. I saw the posting from our bassist Richard on your site where he says he still has everything we recorded in a shoebox. I’d say there’s a lot of music in that there box.

++ It’s hard to pick one song to be my favourite, but perhaps “Head Still Full of You” might be mine, if you don’t mind, care telling me the story behind this song?

I don’t mind telling you at all. It’s a song about my first “proper” girlfriend. That classic tale of letting someone go only to realise you’ve made a mistake…but you’re too late sunshine. The line, “If the light should flicker on the landing there” still gives me a giggle. My girlfriend’s Mum was in full support of us having a little privacy upstairs but her Dad was completely against it. When he began threatening to go up and investigate, her Mum would secretly run out into the hallway and flash the hallway light three times. “The warning signs beneath the stairs” was the sound of my girlfriend’s dad racing up to catch us red-handed. By the time he got to the room he was greeted with the sight of two happy teenagers playing Scrabble.

++ Which of all your songs would you call your favourite and why?

I like “Head Still Full Of You” a lot. Other songs like “Coming Up Roses”, “Change Your Mind”, “It Stays With Me Always” and “One Man’s Words” were up there too. Above all of them though, my most favourite song is “Midnight”. We kind of formed around that song. When I wrote it, I was inspired to keep going so it really did kick everything off. We would always end our set with it. Suzy’s brother played a lovely cello part for the recording. If I had my time again I’d give it three more key changes at the end. With a choir and whales song 😉

++ Because your songs are in the Harlow archive, I guess it’s safe to assume you were based in Harlow? If so, how was it back in the day? What were other bands in your area that you liked? What were the places you used to hang out?

The music scene in Harlow back then was rampant. All my friends were in bands. GOOD bands. The Sullivans, This Happy Breed, The Pressure, The Internationalists, Real By Reel, The Pharoes, The Gamekeepers, Howard & Clack, Attila The Stockbroker, Austin’s Shirts, The Hermit Crabs, Blind Testament, Blue Summer, On The Pulsebeat, Respect, Heartland, Midnight Panic, The Neurotics (of course) etc. If you weren’t in a band you were doing sound for those bands, taking pictures for them, making videos, writing about them or just being there and enjoying it all. We played loads of benefit gigs to help people. There was a great community, a belonging attached to the whole thing. Well, these were the Thatcher years after all. Bleak times.

Paul Howard and Simon Lomond created the full day benefit festivals called “Ego Problems” to help the miners and the Anti Apartheid Movement. It was ironic name because nobody really had an ego problem at all. Steve Lamacq was chronicling everything with his monthly fanzine release “Pack Of Lies”. Coaches were being ordered every week to take people up to London venues to give folk a chance to see the bands somewhere else other than The Square. No disrespect intended though. That was our HQ and we played the hell out of it. There were other venues like The AUEW Hall, The Football Club Bar, Victoria Hall in the Old Town and even The Golden Swift.

The Hare Pub tended to be a big hangout for everyone. That had a lot to do with its proximity to The Square…and the hospital. Harlow wasn’t the friendliest of towns to wander around back then. I often think that the thuggish element to the place gave us a stronger resolve to create our own world out of New Town drabness.

++ Did you gig much with Some Other Day? What were your best gigs? Any anecdotes you can share?

The London gigs were always full of some kind of drama. We played The Mean Fiddler in Harlesden and found ourselves going on after The Mega City Four. They were full of their Les Paul swagger in the sound check and when they hit their first power chord Richard just let out an involuntary “Oh noooo!” so they glared hatefully at us. Neither band was the least bit suited but that’s how things were in those days. The venues liked to cram in bands without much thought. Anyway, when it came for our time to play I meant to make a comment about how rocking MCF were and how different we are to them. For some reason I articulated that as, “Fuck, but that lot were loud weren’t they?” During the next song I felt some weird contact on my head. At the end of the gig I reached up to discover some well-aimed globs of chewing gum permanently intertwined in my hair. I went to look for the Mega’s to “discuss” this (they’d been above us in the balcony so they were banged to rights) but they’d taken their crimped loveliness out of harm’s way.

This is not a gig story but one I’d promised earlier. During an interview on Radio Essex I was asked, “What would you call your music?” and by way of a protest to such a crap question I blurted out “Trouser Music”. The bemused radio guy pressed me for an explanation but I just retorted with “Well isn’t it obvious?” Richard picked up on this and decided that what we played was indeed “Trouser Music” and we hatched a plot to use this moniker to our benefit. We decided that we’d announce the release of our newly christened demo “Inside Leg Measurement” (geddit?) to every record company by first sending them a pair of trousers with the message “Trouser Music Is Coming” stapled to the fly. We obtained the trousers by offering free admission to a Square gig around that time. By the end of that night there were pairs of slacks hanging from every beam and rafter. We took hundreds of pairs of trousers to the Post Office and sent the message to every record company in existence. We then waited a full month and sent the tape declaring “Trouser Music Is Here!” One reply came back as, “I like your music but I can’t use it on my label. Your campaign to gain my attention is already a legend in our office though. Thanks”.

++ Tell me about the 1985 Rock Contest? How was that?

Our first gig? It went quite well if I remember. It just so good to be able to take it onto a stage and have Billy’s drums blazing away behind us. We did a song called “Restless” which didn’t make the distance but I always loved that song. Also, we had an actual Irish reel that I’d decided to throw in. No joking. I don’t know what made me think we’d get away with that. I’m certainly no Arty McGlynn! More folly of youth right there. We didn’t get to the final of any of those contests. I was just happy to play.

++ You were managed by BBC Radio’s Steve Lamacq. How was that experience?

That was really interesting. Steve had come to Harlow to study journalism at the college. His music interests got him a job reviewing bands for the local paper. He took a shine to us and would come over to Parndon Mill almost every Thursday for rehearsals. We’d have the big band discussion in The Shark pub and plan how to find 150 pairs of trousers and then write the set list. Steve’s enthusiasm was really encouraging. We get a mention in his bio “Going Deaf For A Living” but it wasn’t very favourable. He said something like, “I thought they were the most original band ever but then realised they sounded like everyone else”. Not the end of the world but if you’re only going to get one mention…

We went out to celebrate when Steve got a paste-up job for the NME. I told him he’d be the editor there in six months. I think it took him three. Then I came to the States and would get these letters from Paul saying “Steve is on the radio every night, he’s having a chin-wag with Peel all week!” I met Steve recently at a Neurotics gig at The 100 Club. Myself, Paul Howard and Steve back chatting like it was still 1989. What a great night that was.

++ And how long did the band last? When did you call it a day?

I would say we lasted for about two years. I suppose we were just one of those bands where, if you lose one member, it just doesn’t fit back together again in the same way. Like we lost the instruction manual. Billy was experimenting with different ideas for drums. There was a move for him to make our songs a lot more rhythmic, almost like dance music. I felt it was too busy and didn’t leave enough space for the songs to breath. There was a little bit of a disagreement and I think we went off in search of a more traditional drum sound. In hindsight the man had a good plan. It might’ve moved us somewhere more interesting. We tried out a few people but it just made us realize how good Billy had been.

++ Are you all still in touch? What happened afterwards?

I have contact with Billy and we’ve bumped into each other on the odd occasion when I’m back in England. I haven’t talked to either Suzy or Richard since 1993. There was no bad feeling. I don’t know really, people just drift away.

++ Today, what are you up to? What other hobbies aside from music do you have?

Music keeps me nice and busy with my duo Walshey & Westy. My new wave/punk cover band The Shakespearo’s are reforming with some new ideas. Apart from that I have my full time job working in a day centre for developmentally disabled adults. I hike a lot here and walk my feet off myself in general.

++ Looking back though, what would you say was the biggest highlight of the band?

I loved going to record at RMS Studios. There was a real feeling of creativity in there and I was encouraged to dream a little about what might be. It didn’t happen for us, but there you go!

++ One last question, being in the US, what is it that you miss the most from the UK?

The people. When I go home I notice things that many of my friends probably take for granted. The communal spirit and the deep companionship I have with my friends and family in England makes leaving each time a really heartbreaking experience. I often wonder what would’ve happened if I’d have stuck to that two month plan. I shouldn’t complain though. I’ve had a good life here and met some wonderful folk along the way.

++ Let’s wrap it here, thanks so much for the interview. Anything else you’d like to add?

I just want to thank you so much for showing an interest in the band and helping me remember so many great times.

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Listen
Some Other Day – Head Still Full of You

Thanks so much to Fran Wright for this interview. Some years ago I interviewed Simon from The Lowthers, and some weeks ago I was contacted by Fran. I thought it would be very cool to hear his own perspective of the Lowthers’ story as a band, and his own Manchester. I hope you enjoy it!

++ Hi Fran, thanks a lot for the interview. In the past I chatted with Simon from the band, it’s cool to hear now from you and from your perspective the story of The Lowthers. So let’s start from the beginning. You were in a band called The Pop Stars. Tell me a bit about them. Any recordings?

The Pop Stars was the band that Simon and I originally intended to form back in Sale. We had a lot to learn about the nuts and bolts of making music but from the beginning we were very good songwriters and we knew it. We both played guitar and sang and our intention was to find a bass player and drummer and to be a 2 guitar, bass, drums four piece with us both singing our own songs. We demoed a few early songs as duets but the only possibly surviving recording I’m aware of was a cassette that was a joke Christmas album that we recorded on Simon’s old piano. It amused us at the time.

++ How was Manchester back then? What were the bands you liked in town? And where did you usually hang out?

In those days the city was a bit grim, nothing like it is today. Simon and I spent more time in the pubs of Sale talking about music than we did exploring what other bands were doing in the city centre. In terms of playing live we played at the Boardwalk more than anywhere else. Actually there were a lot of bands who weren’t very indie at all but when the Madchester thing started they adapted and gave the industry what they were looking for. You still had to search out the alternative scene, though, and a lot of our friends were goths. The vast majority of the nightlife in Manchester was still all about plastic, mainstream music, and as people say, the only thing that was 24 hour was the Spar.

Apart from the Smiths I was really, into James who I first saw supporting the Smiths at the Palace Theatre on the Meat is Murder tour, and I saw them loads of times in Manchester. They were very indie at that point and they played live a lot around Manchester. I’m proud to say that I went to a free festival at Platt’s Fields where James were 2nd on the bill behind Simply Red and I left as soon as I’d seen James. They were on a double bill with the Stone Roses in an anti-clause 28* benefit gig and they were so incredible I went home and wrote ‘What For?’ all over my body in indelible marker. The Stone Roses (who hadn’t quite broken through) were rather ordinary that night, I thought.

++ Do you remember how The Lowthers came to be?

Simon met Roger studying art in Salford, he had a band called Of That Ilk that he had formed with Rick, a guitarist who was leaving Manchester and so Of That Ilk slowly dissolved and got merged with The Pop Stars to form The Lowthers. By the end of the process Simon was the sole singer and I was the sole guitarist, with Julian, who had been in Of That Ilk, on bass and Roger on drums. Julian left after a while and was replaced by Brendan Bell who Simon and I knew from Altrincham (he now lives in West Virginia, USA). Brendan’s a very decent musician and, musically speaking that was the best period of the band for me.

Roger also wrote songs and so we were unusual in that we were a four piece band that had three songwriters, all of whom wrote songs good enough to form a band around. It was good in that it meant we were overflowing with material, even when we were finding our feet musically, but I suppose that it caused some tensions as well. I would have preferred for us to have two guitars and for Simon, Roger and I to sing our own songs and I don’t really know why I never suggested that.

++ Simon told me no one was interested in releasing a record for you. Why do you think that was?

Island Records said ‘we like the Smiths too but we can’t make a living out of it’. A woman from Playtime Records said ‘You sound too like the Smiths’, I said ‘we sound much more like James than The Smiths’ and she said ‘James sound like The Smiths’, so it was no win really. It was like a Sitar player being told he sounded too like Ravi Shankar by someone who knows squat about Indian classical music.

We loved the Smiths and we were influenced by them but I always thought we were more influenced by James (circa Stutter and Strip Mine) and The Wedding Present (circa George Best). Simon recently told me that he can’t stand the Wedding Present which shocked me I must say. And Sylvia didn’t really represent our sound. I’m proud of the song but the recording was a bit rushed, we just went into the studio and did what the engineer told us. It had a very Marresque guitar line but the vocal phrasing was totally unlike anything that Morrissey would ever do, but I can see how some people perceived us through that one record despite sending them demo tapes and playing live where we had a much rougher and more energetic sound.

With hindsight I think we expected things to happen too quickly. We weren’t together that long and towards the end we were getting much tighter and developing our own sound more and more, but the exposure that came from the Disparate Cogscienti was perhaps a bit too soon for us, and the demos we sent out were very amateur.

++ You recorded a bunch of demos. I’m sure many would be interested in listening to them. How many demo tapes did you made and what was the tracklist?

For a time there were a lot of tapes floating about but the only one I have now is of us playing four songs in Brendan’s living room in Altrincham, not long before we split. It’s a crude recording but I think we sound pretty good in places. The songs on it are ‘Your Stare’, which I wrote, ‘Loyalty’, which Roger wrote, and one of Simon’s whose title I’ve forgotten but the chorus goes ‘I don’t care ‘cos I think you’re square, and you can take your money and stick it elsewhere’. There’s also a track that I wrote called ‘Kill Indie Pop’. (I really like Indie Pop, this was just a beef about people not doing it properly). I’ll send you a copy!

++ I’m not familiar with many of your songs, but I’m still curious to know which of your songs was your favourite and why?

Some of the songs I wrote for the Lowthers I wrote when I was 17/18 and so I’ve developed a lot since then, by the time I was in my mid 20s I’d learned to be more direct but I’m still proud of all the songs I wrote for the Lowthers and Simon and Roger were terrific songwriters. My favourite Simon song was ‘Look what the stalk brought’ and my favourite Roger song was called ‘Tell me to Jump’.

I think most fondly of the only two songs that Simon and I collaborated on, (the 3 songwriters nearly always wrote complete songs). There was one song called ‘The Turkeys Vote for Christmas’ that Simon wrote the words for and I wrote the music for and it had great lyrics and a souped up REM style riff that worked really well live. Another was called ‘Up Out and Away’, I wrote most of it but Simon came up with a verse and the title that really finished it off and brought it alive. That had a screaming delay pedal over the chorus and again, it was really good to play live.

++ The most known song perhaps is “Sylvia” that appeared on the “The Disparate Cogscienti” compilation that Mark E. Smith put together. What’s the story behind that song?

I wrote it when I was 18. Sylvia was my mother’s name and she died when I was eight, but it’s not about her as a person. I used the name Sylvia because it scanned and it evoked the 60s. It’s about the desire for a perfect love that will make everything right. When I reached adolescence the only preparation I had was my family’s rather Victorian worldview and I felt confused and bereft without a mother and I was trying to capture this desperate feeling in the song. The chorus goes ‘I’m saving myself for Sylvia’ but it’s not about celibacy or virginity as some reviews thought: it’s about clinging on to life, keeping yourself alive because of the idea that out there is a perfect love that will solve all your problems and finally make you happy.

++ And did you ever met or hanged out with Mark?

He turned up at the studio and it was pretty excruciating. We had virtually no studio experience, Roger and I were about to do a harmonised backing vocal on the chorus when the intercom went and Mark E Smith appeared on the other side of the glass. He immediately took charge and told the engineer what he wanted, and the engineer who was an ex teacher suddenly started showing off because a pop star had turned up. Roger and I probably would have struggled to do the backing vocal anyway but having Mark E Smith on the other side telling us where we were going wrong made sure we went to pieces and cocked it up royally. Simon stepped in and did it perfectly well in one take.

Roger used to mither him, which doesn’t really count as hanging out, and I think Brendan passed him a spliff at a dinner party but I’ve no idea how that came about.

++ What was the creative process for the band?

The Songwriter presented a song by singing it through with a guitar and we took it from there. Translating songs into an arrangement for guitar, bass, drums and vocals was something we sort of did together but I remember feeling that it was quite a burden for me to come up with guitar arrangements that weren’t just block chords through the whole thing cos at the time I liked to build it around riffs. It did my head in to be concentrating on the guitar so much because I always thought of myself as more of a songwriter than a musician. Roger was an excellent drummer with an unusually soft open hand style that he had learned from his Dad and we treated the drums like they were as important as the other instruments in forming the sound. When Brendan replaced Julian on bass I thought that musically we started to reach that point where the thing that happens collectively is more than the sum of its parts, but by then we were falling apart in other ways.

++ Simon mentioned that usually the reviews weren’t really favourable, do you agree with him?

It seemed then, and it probably still seems, that for magazines that see themselves as being on the cutting edge there’s no middle ground. Everything was either total genius or offensively pointless. The NME gave an All About Eve album 0 out of 10 and said ‘Wayne Hussey sings backing vocals and so is eternally damned by association.’ So given that, I didn’t think we did too badly. City Life, a Manchester magazine said nice things about us, it was just that the NME and Melody Maker damned us with faint praise which really felt awful. We were young and we thought that things might be happening for us really quickly and then it was dashed. But looking at it now I think if we had kept going we’d have picked up a lot more positive reviews. We thought we were outstanding and couldn’t understand why other people didn’t see that too. Obviously that was a bit immature.

++ What was your favourite music mag back then? Did you follow and read lots of fanzines too?

The NME was taken terribly seriously then and I used to go to Sale Library on Mondays and read it cover to cover. It was very funny, very political and I had no problem with its vicious tongue, it offended me that the charts and the radio were clogged up with shite and NME never held back in laying into stuff they didn’t like. Politically these were stark, frightening times, the Thatcher government was screwing the unions, laying waste to provincial towns and cities, and introducing homophobic legislation. The NME had contempt for musicians that had nothing to say about what was happening. I’ve just heard that it’s become a free paper which is sad, but it hasn’t been what it was for a long, long time now.

* Clause 28 was legislation the government was passing which forbade local authorities from ‘promoting homosexuality’. By the time it was passed it was called Section 28 but it was in place until the Labour government repealed it when it came into office in 1997. It was terrifying and there was a huge campaign against it.

++ During those mid and late 80s there were so many guitar pop bands. Did you feel part of a scene? And today, how would you prefer being categorized, indiepop or C86?

There always were guitar bands everywhere, the only difference was that suddenly journalists and A&R people moved their expense accounts into the city for a while and took notice of some of these bands. I do believe that musical and songwriting talent is fairly constant, it’s the industry that ebbs and flows. Apart from one support slot with My Bloody Valentine in York we only ever played in Manchester we were rarely on the same bill as bands that we felt any affinity with.

We slightly after the C86 scene so we didn’t feel part of that. I can’t speak for the rest of the band but I totally embrace the label ‘indie pop’. Punk had stripped away the pretentiousness and the needless complexity and indie pop removed the machismo. That was vital for me, it was about writing honestly about sexuality and what it was really like to be a young person. Unfortunately it came to be seen as just a gimmicky phase that bands went through before they could afford more expensive equipment and wanted to play stadiums. I’m so glad that people are taking it seriously as a genre once more, maybe it could become a long term form like Blues, Country or Reggae. I’ve moved on musically in that I’ve left the frenetic guitar sound behind but it’s still about an indie pop attitude: what Leonard Cohen called telling the truth about a song.

++ And where did you usually recorded your demos? Did you enjoy recording as much as gigging?

The band only went into the studio twice, which seems shocking now. Once to record Sylvia for the Disparate Cogscienti and once after I’d left. All our demos were either live recordings from the mixing desk or tape recordings in living rooms and they were pretty primitive. I didn’t learn anything about recording until after the Lowthers.

We usually practiced in Roger’s front room in Prestwich, and there’d be a mono tape recorder with a pair of Walkman headphones for a microphone. They sounded remarkably good considering, but it was naïve to submit the result to the Manchester Evening News who said it sounded like it had been recorded in a lake. Their demo of the week in the same issue was from The Inspiral Carpets. Obviously they were a lot more professional than us but I thought, and I still think that we were better than them.

++ Talking about gigs, what were your favourite gigs and why? And the worst?

My favourite gig was the last one, at the Boardwalk in Manchester. Brendan was in the band by then and we were starting to sound really abrasive and bright. We were playing ‘Turkeys Vote for Christmas’ and I noticed that people at the bar, behind the bar and around the place who hadn’t come to see us were getting into it. It’s a shame that we never built on that.

My worst one was probably the first one. Somehow Roger had got us on the bill at the International which was a very decent venue but the other bands were truly dreadful jazz/funk outfits. I had a hangover, there was only our friends down the front and a great big space behind them and we’d had a totally useless soundcheck. After the first song Simon turned to me and said (on the mic) ‘Fran, your sister’s here!’ as she walked across the cavernous space. We took ourselves seriously from the beginning because we felt so confident in our songs, but we had a quite bit to learn.

++ When and why did you split?

It was 1988 or 1989 and it was largely my fault. As the band became more polished musically Simon and I started to argue about music. I was never entirely comfortable with the way we lined up because originally we had both played guitar and sang, and with him doing just vocals and me doing just guitar I started to feel that I was doing more to bring his songs to life than I was getting in return. Simon had a very good voice for the songs he was writing but I thought that he wasn’t practicing and pushing himself to improve enough as much as the rest of the band and it was placing limits on what we could do musically. So I quit, and the band carried on for a few more weeks before calling it a day.

Simon and I were both headstrong but I was too demanding and we could have found a way forward. I thought that he was getting to concentrate on song writing without having to do any of the musical heavy lifting but it got tied up with personal issues I was going through – life was very hard for me away from the band and I started to expect too much from Simon as a musical partner and as a friend. I’d also say that, while I always appreciated Roger as a drummer I didn’t appreciate at the time the work he put into getting us bookings and sending out demos.

++ Are you still in touch with the rest of the band?

Simon and I gave each other the cold shoulder for a short while but we were soon friends again and we saw a lot of each other before I left Manchester to go to college to study drama in Yorkshire in 1990, and he was best man at my wedding in 1997.We’re still in touch but we don’t interact much to be honest which is a pity. I last saw Roger at Simon’s wedding and we’re not in touch but I’d be happy to see him again. Julian was a nice guy but we were never close and we lost touch when he left the band. I didn’t hear from Brendan for a long time until I found him on facebook. He’s moved to the USA and I was hugely impressed to hear that he goes ‘way back’ as they say with John Darnielle from the Mountain Goats.

++ Have you been involved with music after The Lowthers?

Sure, these days I record under the name Lokomotiv Stockport which is the format I’ve used for the last fifteen years or so. Prior to that I formed a short lived college band in Yorkshire called Jason and the Lagernauts and then I went to South East London where I did quite a bit of playing live as a solo act and recording with a musician called Toby Deans under the name The Plum Corporation. But I must have angered the gods of music because when I was in my late twenties I started suffering from mysterious muscular skeletal issues that stopped me singing or playing guitar or piano for years and years. I’d already been diagnosed with depression which has been recurrent, and at times severe, so life was very hard for a while.

But in 2007 my health improved enough to I get into low budget home studio stuff and so I started recording lost songs under the Lokomotiv Stockport banner. I wanted to record a trilogy of ‘lost albums’ made up of all the songs that had been lost to illness, but I only managed to put out one album out in 2008 before my health dipped again. The album that made it was called ‘My Jangling Heart’ and was billed as ‘10 Songs about Romantic Pain and Incompetence – Sparkling Indie Pop from the North of England’

Mercifully I’ve now discovered medication that controls my symptoms enough to make music so I’ve put together another eight track album of songs from the Jason & the Lagernauts and the Plum years and I hope to get more out in the new future. I still write songs, but there are so many old songs waiting to be recorded that new material has to be really good to get a look in. I want to get to the point where all the old songs are out there and out of my system and I can concentrate on new material.

Actually, reminiscing about the Lowthers is tempting me to upload some acoustic versions of Lowthers songs so I might do that on the Lokmotiv Stockport Bandcamp page before too long.

Professionally I’m involved in music in that I’m now a piano tuner by profession.

++ Looking back in time, what would you say was the biggest highlight for you in The Lowthers?

In the beginning playing live was totally draining because of the nerves and the horrible feeling that it wasn’t coming out how we wanted it. But when we’d improved there were moments on stage and in rehearsal when it felt like we were producing a beautiful energy and it was expressing how we felt and that was a really great experience.

++ These days, aside from music, what hobbies do you have?

I’ve been a Barnsley FC season ticket holder for years but I’ve given up hoping that they are going to do anything glorious. I occasionally write plays but none of them have been produced beyond local amateur productions so far. My wife (Susan Elliot Wright) has become successful in the last few years as a novelist, and so she encourages me with the idea of writing prose fiction. During the long years when I couldn’t make music I really went to town on discovering new music and these days I’m hooked on music from Nigeria and Zimbabwe. I also got into studying theology which no one expected, least of all me. But music is still a massive part of my life, that and walking the dog.

++ Man U or City?

United. Sale is in between United and Altrincham, a non-league team, and I used to watch them too. But I’ve since a shameful thing and switched allegiance. In 1990 after moving to Yorkshire I started watching Barnsley FC. At that time United had just become a PLC and the last time I went to Old Trafford it was like having a box at the opera, so I’ve supported Barnsley since then but I have to say, it’s not for the faint hearted. And even though I no longer support United I still laugh at City and hate Liverpool.

++ Let’s wrap it here, anything else you’d like to add?

I’d just like to say how great it is that people are taking indie pop seriously again and that anyone who is interested in the British indie pop scene in the 80s should have a look at what was coming out of Zimbabwe at the same time, in particular artists like John Chibadura, the Four Brothers and Tryson Chimbetu and the Marxist Brothers. They’re incredible and there’s a massive indie pop overlap going on.You’ll be amazed.

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Listen
The Lowthers – Sylvia

Thanks so much to Arlo and Felix for this great interview! Back in October I wrote a small piece about Feral on the blog, and through Facebook Arlo got in touch with me. Happily he was keen to tell the story of this great band from England that only released one 7″, but what a great 7″ it is!

++ Hi guys! Thanks so much for being up for this interview. Tell me, are you still based in Crawcrook or Newcastle? And how was Crawcrook back in the days of Feral? Has it changed much?

Arlo: Hiya Roque. Happy New Year! No problem at all for doing the interview. It’s not often we get a chance to talk about Feral these days, so we’re happy to be given the chance. Crawcrook was (as you’d mentioned in your piece about our single) a small coal-mining town from about 1850 up to about 1960. It’s on the banks of the River Tyne, which runs through Newcastle 5 miles further downstream. The pits had all closed before we were born, so it was pretty much a rural ‘commuter town’ for Newcastle. A pretty good place to grow up. Close enough to the city to be able to stay attached to civilisation, but with a touch of the weird pagan shit that still goes on in abundance further inland, in the hills of Northumberland. There are little villages not far from us, with names like Twice Brewed and Scroggwood, where they spend their Saturday nights dancing round swords and singing accordian tunes to the moon. We all moved into Newcastle in our late teens and twenties and got more involved in the music scene. We ran Newcastle’s top ‘indie’ night, The Palace, through the 1990s at the legendary Riverside venue (now no more). It was a good mix of music. Classic indie, Manchester stuff, Britpop, dance, 60s psych and northern soul and a bit of hip-hop thrown in. It was run mainly as a club for us and our friends, with the guest-list running to over a hundred people most weeks. It was class! 500 or so people getting together in a great venue every Friday. Good live bands, good music and a great atmosphere. Me and Steve have moved back out to Crawcrook and neighbouring Ryton now, and still see each regularly. Felix landed a class job designing toy cars for Hot Wheels, and has ended up in LA. He was (until just a few weeks ago) Vice President of Hot Wheels, and has been spending the last few years project managing mad, life-sized loop-the-loops for suped-up cars in the deserts of America. We still keep in close touch, swapping music files we’re working on. I was over there visiting him about 6 weeks ago. Stu Lowey, our guitarist, died aged 28 in 2001. He developed Creutzfeldt-Jakob disease (the human form of Mad-Cow disease) in his mid 20s, probably caused by bovine growth hormones he’d been given as a child.

++ Arlo was telling me that he likes the photo on the cover of the 7″ because you looked all covered in coal dust after a hard days shift down the pit. Is that so? Did you work in a coal mine?

Arlo: It was taken after a hard day’s photo-shoot with Yozzer Hughes, a deranged Scouse maverick who also produced Change You Even. Bit of a Fagin type character. He took pride in taunting all the other Newcastle bands that Feral were the only ones who were gonna get anywhere ‘cos they’re fookin seventeen’! He had us dug into a fox-hole, covered in bracken and fallen branches. We’d been hunched in there for about three hours by the time he actually got the shot he wanted.

Felix: Real lateral thought displayed there by Yozza…..”I know,….. they’re called feral so I’ll drive them out to the woods and stick them in a ditch”. From memory he spent quite a bit of time telling us how long it had taken him to scout for the location….in hindsight we should have asked him what he was doing wandering around in the woods looking for a ditch to put seventeen year old boys in…

++ Tell me then how did you all meet? And have you been in bands before Feral?

Arlo: We all met at school and lived within about a mile of each other as kids. Me, Felix and Steve met aged 4 in primary school, and met Stu at Ryton Comprehensive school aged 11. We hung around together for years before we started playing music. We’d been a pretty tight gang through our teenage years, skateboarding, graffiti art-ing, listening to music and generally hanging around street corners. Feral took a little while to properly coalesce from various mates going round each other’s garages and bedrooms and making a racket.

Felix: From memory the idea of a band started forming when we were about fifteen. Me and Stu used to dream about it and eventually figured if we were going to be in a band we’d better get somebody in it who could actually play an instrument….so we subtly courted Arlo. I picked up the bass because I figured four strings would be easier to learn than six. Steve had had drum lessons when we were seven so we pretty much told him he was the drummer.

++ What are your first musical memories? And what inspired you to make music?

Arlo: I’ve been indoctrinated from birth. My Grandad was a miner in County Durham who had a massive record collection dating back to the invention of the gramaphone. They had nothing else of value in the house, but he had full rooms which were literally floor to ceiling with records! He used to play old novelty records for me as a kid, along with the classical and opera stuff he was into, and bought me my first 7” singles when I was 3, On The Trail of the Lonesome Pine by Laurel and Hardy and Bohemian Rhapsody by Queen. (I used to think the first line was ‘Is this the real life or is this just Plasticine?’ Much better lyrics, in my opinion.) My Mam and Dad were both well into their music too. Massive fans of The Beatles, Dylan, Paul Simon, The Incredible String Band etc. I can remember days at home with my Mam, pre-school (so aged 4 or less), sitting using her washing basket as a boat and listening to Cripple Creek Ferry by Neil Young and The Hedgehog Song by The Incredibles. I took a shine to Jimi Hendrix when I was about 8 after seeing a documentary on the BBC that my Dad had recorded. My folks weren’t particularly into Hendrix. They’d seen him at the Isle of White Festival in 1970 (where they also saw Arlo Guthrie, hence my name). But I was smitten. I badgered them for a guitar for Christmas, and got a real cheap nylon – stringed acoustic. One of my Dad’s mates gave me a couple of lessons and persuaded my Dad that I needed a better guitar, so I got a Hondo Les Paul copy the next Christmas. Much easier to play behind my head. Me, Felix, Steve and Stu went through our early teens sharing tapes of New Order, Bomb The Bass, Run DMC, Public Enemy, Eric B and Rakim and skate videos with tunes by The Descendents, Firehose, Sonic Youth etc. But it was really the first time we heard The Stone Roses that the idea of being a band crystalised. Me and Steve had been to RPM records in Newcastle the day She Bangs The Drums came out. I bought the album, and Steve bought the 12”, along with a batch of other bands’ records. We both went home and had a listen through the day’s new purchases, and were both just floored when we put the Roses on. Straight on the phone to each other, raving about them. And they were immediately put onto tape for that evening, racing round the country lanes of Northumberland in Felix’s VW Passat with Waterfall and Resurrection blasting at top volume. I don’t know about the rest of the band, but for me that was the day it all changed. We’d been playing around with guitars and writing a few songs together before The Roses, but that was when I decided we could be a ‘proper band’.

++ And where does the name of the band come from? Is there a story behind it?

Arlo: Feral was a character in a story in 2000AD (Strontium Dogs, I think). Steve had picked up on it as a cool word/band-name. It was like every band, hunting around for a name. It was just the least ridiculous one we came up with!

Felix: I think we settled on it in the car on our way to our first Deckham music collective gig.

++ What would you say were your influences at the time of Feral? What were you listening to?

Arlo: We were coming back round to guitars after having been into hip-hop for a few years. The skate videos I mentioned played a big part in that to begin with. We were into stuff by Dinosaur Jr, Ultra Vivid Scene, Sonic Youth etc. The Manchester scene was starting to kick off, led by the Roses, Mondays and Carpets and that was when we started going out to gigs. Most of the venues in Newcastle were ‘over 18’. We’d been reluctant to travel into town just to get turned away from gigs at the door for being under-age. So we missed out on the Roses at Newcastle Riverside. We went down a few weeks after for The Charlatans’ first Newcastle gig, and got in no-bother. Then realised that half the kids in there were younger than us! After that, we were out every week to see bands at The Riverside and Newcastle’s grottiest little indie venue, The Broken Doll. Stephen Joyce used to put The Whoosh Club on at The Broken Doll. Usually three bands, two of them local, for £1.50. We went to see Ride’s first Newcastle gig at a Whoosh night. They’d been signed to Creation Records and started attracting a lot of attention between Stephen booking them and the actual gig. There must have been over 300 people crammed into a room that was a bit of a squeeze for 100! Whoosh nights got us into Creation Records stuff, particularly My Bloody Valentine, which influenced how we used the guitars, noise and distortion to create textures. And introduced us to a load of new guitar music, Five Thirty, Boo Radleys, Swervedriver etc etc.

Felix: As the band progressed we started going to Raves, what started out as a very jingle jangle band progressed into something quite rich with looped patterns later on.

++ There were plenty of guitar bands in the late 80s, early 90s, the now so called C86 sound. So I wonder if you felt part of a scene then?

Arlo: Nah, not really. We were into the Manchester bands, but didn’t come from Manchester, so were exempt from that. We were into the shoegazey bands I’ve mentioned above, but not really part of any ‘scene’ with them either. There was a good scene in Newcastle at the time. We did a load of gigs with The Lavender Faction, The Sunflowers, Crane, Goose, Deep, The Acrylic Tones, Razorblade Smile, Unexplained Laughter. And a lot of those bands made up the crowd who used to get along to the Palace club over the next few years.

++ Did you play many gigs? Any favourites? Any not so favourite?

Arlo: We did loads of gigs. Mostly in the North East of England, but we did a few round the country. We got some offers to go to mainland Europe but just never got it sorted. We were pretty hapless on the organisation side! Scotland gigs were always good fun. Better licensing laws meant the bands didn’t start til later in the night, by which time the drink was usually flowing and the crowds were always up for a laugh. Probably my best memory of a gig was the second one we played, at the school we all went. We persuaded them to let us have the main hall for the night, filled it with a couple of hundred school mates and just had a proper celebratory party. It was where we and our friends all There was a good one where we were supporting another local band, Razorblade Smile. I think there’d been some wrangling about who was going to headline. We went on before them and played covers of their entire set. We hadn’t told them beforehand, so they were a bit put out that they had nothing left rehearsed to play that we hadn’t just done. We did loads of shite little gigs at the start, especially when we were in that Deckham Collective. Each band had half a dozen people there to see them, and none of the bands liked each other’s music. They were pretty soul-destroying, but they were a means to an end, securing us the use of cheap practice rooms.

Felix: One thing I remember about the shite little gigs was how loud we were compared to the other bands. We were this little four piece band made up of scraggly teenagers pushing AMPS on stage that were bigger than us. A favourite early gig of mine was a Lust records Christmas party where we had ten people on stage with us doing Kylie Minogue’s ‘better the devil you Know’. I think Steve finished that set by throwing his high hats through the window….upstairs at the Broken Doll.

++ You released just the one 7″ on Lust Recordings. How did this relationship came to be?

Arlo: We sent Stephen Joyce a tape of some demos after we’d been to one of the Whoosh nights he put on. We were just looking for gigs really. He put us on at the Whoosh a few times and we went down well. He’d already released a few singles on the Whoosh label, but was starting up again under the name Lust Recordings. I think the first Lust Record was a Lavender Faction 12”, and we were the second. We were planning more, but Stephen was busy working as Kevin Shields’ (MBV) guitar technician. When Loveless came out, and during the tour that followed it, he was away. We were refusing to even answer the calls we were getting from other record labels, cos we were happy on Lust Recordings. By the time we realised that Stephen wasn’t going to be around to manage us or sort out getting the next single recorded, we’d lost all momentum.

++ So the A side has the name of the song wrong. What was the song’s original name? What happened?

Arlo: That was Stephen Joyce’s bad hearing. Too many MBV gigs! It was called Change You Even (from the chorus lyrics: I’d never change you even though I’ll never want you as you are). He just misheard me, and we’d purposely put the vocal low in the mix. We only realised the day the records came back from the pressing plant, by which point it was too late to put right.

++ And in a sentence or two, could you tell me the story behind each song on the single?

Arlo: Change You Even was us messing about with a guitar tuning I came up with. DADAAD for anyone who’s interested. Loads of drone! We got three new songs in a week just out of that tuning. It turned out to be about 8 minutes long, which we didn’t notice til we started recording it. The lyrics are just teenage, heart-on-sleeve, here’s what I’m thinking about today sort of stuff. Bridge is a song to a mate of ours, Rob Quick, who committed suicide that year. His was one of the garages we used to go round to and make a noise. I came up with the song while I was at the Tin Bridge over the River Tyne at Wylam. It was a disused, derelict railway bridge we used to hang around at, and where I’d had a pretty in-depth discussion with Rob not long before he died. Away came out of us getting our hands on a 4-track cassette portastudio for the first time. It was originally layers of swirling guitar noise over a lullaby-strum. Then flipping the cassette over to record layers of backwards guitar. The version on the single was an attempt to make a ‘releasable song’ out of that idea. I prefer the rough-as-fuck original sketch to the version we put out on the single.

++ What do you remember of the recording sessions at Hi Level in Newcastle? Any fun anecdotes to share?

Arlo: It was produced by John ‘Yozzer’ Hughes, veteran record shop owner in Newcastle, and all-round knob. He’s the bloke who had us hiding in muddy holes for the cover photo. He had worked with The Dickies, and reckoned he used to hang out with Robert Calvert from Hawkwind. He claimed to have Calvert’s one-stringed Ukrainian fiddle (not a euphemism!) mounted on his wall at home.

Felix: Ironically I spent a large chunk of my childhood travelling round various pagan sites with my crazy hippie aunt in a battered Bedford van listening to Hawkwind and Zappa so I thought the eukranian fiddle and his tales of Brock and Calvert were quite impressive

Arlo: He was trying to force-feed us some terrible 70s prog, groups like Tractor and stuff no-one has ever heard of. Trying to influence the sound in a new direction which none of us bought into in any way. He dismantled the studio’s monitoring system and wired in some knackered car-speakers. Mixed the single through them, claiming that if it sounds good through them, it’ll sound good through anything. It just ended up sounding shit through anything! We did some good stuff there though. It was on the top floor of an old 5 storey building. We used the bare brick stairwell as an echo chamber, with about 100 ft of guitar lead draped down the stairs, an amp at the bottom, and mics set up on each landing. It gave a massive sound to some of the layered guitars at the end of Change You Even. It was an all-night session, cos we got the place cheap through the night, and I can remember going out onto the roof-top overlooking Newcastle city centre as the sun was coming up and the final tweaks were being made to Yozzer’s mix through his crappy speakers.

++ And how come the B side wasn’t recorded there but instead in a home portostudio?

Arlo: That was just a lie! It was recorded at a ‘community studio’ in a place called Consett in the middle of nowhere. The place was set up to record primary-school music workshops, local radio advert voice-overs and that sort of carry-on. The engineer nearly shat himself when we switched our amps on. He had no idea what we were after, and the results weren’t much better than what we’d managed ourselves on the portastudio. So we just said that’s how they were recorded so it didn’t seem like we’d wasted good money on shit mixes.

++ Did you participate perhaps in some compilations?

Arlo: We were members of the Deckham Music Collective in Gateshead for a few months. You’ve never met a more unlikely ‘collective’ in your life. None of the bands had anything in common. The attraction to us was that they had practice rooms and a studio. We recorded some stuff in their studio, literally ran away with the tapes and have still never paid them to this day. The guy chased after us for a couple of years but I think we’ve got away with it now. I think they might have put one of the tunes we recorded that day on a compilation album of seminal Deckham artists such as the mighty ‘Nell Mangle vs The Robinsons’, one of the most hard-hitting satirical double acts to come out of Britain in the 1980s. Check them out if you get a chance.

++ Are there any more Feral recordings? Perhaps on tapes and such?

Arlo: Yeah, I’ll send you them. There was a four song follow up single / EP recorded and ready to go. Unfortunately we only kept masters on cassette (not sure where the DATs went) so the sound quality is a bit ropey. I’ve got some of the multitrack reel-to-reels, but I’m having trouble finding anywhere which has still got their analogue tape machines to go and run off some decent mixes.

++ Then what happened? When did you call it a day? And why?

Arlo: I’ve not called it a day! I still play music and mess around with sound. Feral just dissolved / evolved. Me, Felix and Steve have stayed close friends and collaborators to this day.

++ Were you involved with other bands after Feral? Tell me a bit about each if you can!

Arlo: Not long after the Feral single we became a 3 piece briefly. We then recruited Ian Nagel from The Acrylic Tones on guitar. He was a real 60s aficionado and Feral took on a more psych / jangly sound for a year or so. We then disbanded for a few weeks, Ian continued with the Acrylic Tones, and we recruited Paul Schofield from The Sunflowers on vocals and renamed the band Camp Freddie. Camp Freddie was a good little band. We holed-up in a barn in Felix’s auntie’s house near Morpeth in Northumberland. Hired a sixteen track tape machine and borrowed a mixing desk and some mics and set about writing a new batch of songs. I’ll send you what I can of those home-made recordings. We only did a handful of gigs, but they were good ones. We took a coach load of us down to Sunderland to play at their Saturday night indie club (The Independent, I think), and had a great night. Good gig, loads of friends on an away-day, everyone mashed and a good night’s dancing afterwards! I can’t really remember why we stopped doing Camp Freddie. After a year or two of just running the club-night, and learning how to use a sampler and Cubase on an Atari ST, I got together with a Sunderland lad who’d been on the scene for years, Kristian Atkinson. Me and him cooked up the idea for the next band, The Kustom Built. We were going to work without a drummer, using samples and drum machines, with live guitars and keyboards. The Kustom Built ethos was to take bits and pieces of music from anywhere and bolt them all together into a suped-up mash of punk, funk and psychedelia. F-Punk! Felix was lured back to Newcastle from his job with Mattel to play bass. Stu Craig was poached from Stax Connection on guitar and we had Cam (an old Sunderland mate of Kristian’s) on vocals. Kustom Built put out three EPs on Atomic Records, toured with Clint Boon, played Reading and Leeds festivals and did the first Radio One live session of the millennium. We never really split up, just sort of fizzled out and went our separate ways around 2002.

++ What about today? Do you still play?

Arlo: The Kustom Built been invited to play a festival in Minehead later this year with The Happy Mondays and The Inspiral Carpets and a load others. It’s been a while since we all played together. Felix is coming back from L.A. and Stu from London to do it. Me and Kristian are working on a few new tunes to put out some time soon.

++ And do you have any other hobbies aside from music?

Arlo: I do Judo, playing and coaching. Felix is as into cars as he’s ever been, and is currently working on some cool stuff with stunt drivers The Bandito Brothers. Steve runs a sound system and does a bit of DJing.

++ One last question, looking back to those days, what would you say was Feral’s biggest highlight as a band?

Arlo: Spending the night at Colm (My Bloody Valentine’s drummer)’s house on a London trip. It was the day they’d finished the mixing of Loveless. We spent the night absolutely off our faces listening to the album the whole indie world was dying to hear. We were in an absolute mess the next morning, trying to do an interview with the NME. We got a panning off the journalist for not having much to say, but we were all on a come-down and had just had our efforts put firmly into perspective after hearing one of the greatest records ever made.

++ Thanks again so much! Anything else you’d like to add?

Arlo: Thank you! Sorry it’s taken a few weeks to get back to you. Thanks for showing an interest in our obscure little outfit from the coal-field backwaters of England!

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Listen
Feral – Bridge

Thanks so much to Matthew Berry for the interview! I wrote a small piece about the obscure Hang David some time ago. Matt was kind enough to get in touch and also was up to tell the story about his band from the 80s. These days Matthew still makes music under the name of Melatone. You can listen to one of his new tracks, “If I Fall” here. But today we talk about his old band Hang David who made some lovely jangly songs that Melody Maker once said: “PRETTY, pretty, gently cruising and crooning towards a soft apex on each of four songs, Hang David have an attractive lustre to their guitar dominance as they sparkle, mingle and tingle like early Hurrah! with their mouth full of crisps”.

++ Hi Matt! Thanks a lot for being up for this interview! How are you? Where are you based these days? And where was Hang David based back in the day?

My pleasure! It’s great to know that someone is still interested in the band. I’m good thanks. I live in North London. Hang David were based in London as well – most of us were around West London

++ Was Hang David your first band?

It was my first serious band – I was in a band at school with Bob (the Keyboard player from Hang David). We were called Lost Cause ….which was asking for trouble!

++ I noticed that you are now in a band called Melatone and before that in a band called Duma. Care telling me a bit about these two bands and how different or similar they are to Hang David?

Duma was my first band after Hang David & the first band where I was the singer. We were quite different to Hang David – a 3 piece for one thing, and a bit darker & heavier. Melatone is maybe a blend of the two – some guitar pop and some stuff that is closer to post rock, with vocals (if that makes sense!). We do full band gigs, but I also do a lot of live looping gigs, which are a lot of fun.

++ When did Hang David start as a band? Who were the members and how was the recruiting process?

Hang David started in 87 or 88…not exactly sure. Myself, Bob Cook & Ben Durling (another school friend) got together and then found a drummer (Dave Frisby) and singer in the pub I think. I don’t remember any auditioning at all, I think we just started rehearsing. The original singer was actually a guy called Dom Joly who is now quite a famous comedian in England. That didn’t work out, so we advertised and got Nick Leese. We had a few different bass players.

++ Where does the name Hang David come from?

Hmmm, I should make up something interesting here – I think it was something to do with the drummer Dave messing something up at a rehearsal.…my recollection is a little vague!

++ Your first release, the “Another Day” 12″ came out in 1989. What were you listening at that time? Were you into other jangly guitar bands then?

It was actually a 12” 4 track ep. I had always been a big fan of The Cure, Joy Division etc, but also always loved The Beatles (especially the Revolver album). We were all big fans of Aussie band The Church (who were almost completely unknown in UK). They seemed to combine The Cure kind of thing with a more sixties Beatles sound. You can hear that on the single –there’s lots of nice 12 string and Rickenbacker on there. I think we were also listening to The Stones Roses, maybe REM.

++ It was released on the Vacant label. Who were they?

That was our own label – Ben and me set it up.

++ What do you remember from the recording session for the 7″? Where was it recorded? Were the songs included the easy choices for the record?

We recorded the A side at a studio in Hackney, London. The other 3 tracks we recorded in various places. Another Day was always going to be the A side, I can’t remember whether there were other tracks in contention, but I remember really liking another track called “Halfways”. I can’t remember why we didn’t record that, but maybe we were thinking of that as a second single. I have a nice demo of that somewhere. There was also a track of Ben’s called “Unwind”, but that came later.

++ If it’s not much to ask, what’s the story behind the songs on this 7”

I’ll do my best…

In terms of lyrics I wrote “Another Day” & “Here” & Nick wrote lyrics for “Ride” & “Where You Are”. I wrote the music for the 4 songs, although there was generally quite a lot of band input. “Another Day” & “Here” were both songs about a breakup (aren’t they all?!). Ben had a little 8 track set up and I remember demoing “Another Day” there with Dave McDonald (who produced the 12” and had been bass player in the band briefly). I might even have sung the demo – Dave helped quite a bit with the arrangement and I think he wrote the great lead guitar line (it definitely wasn’t me). I can’t remember much about the writing of the other songs, although I remember the “Here” demo being more electric and layered and us making it gentler and simpler. I really liked “Where You Are”, which was me & Nick (and nice guitar riff from Ben). “Ride” was a bit of a Beatles pastiche.

++ And what about the sleeve? It seems like a child’s drawing. Is it?

I did the sleeve – obviously to look like a child’s drawing (although my hand writing is nearly that bad). We tried some other moodier/artier designs but wanted something simple and slightly naïve and also something that looked good in black and white, as that was all we had the money for!

++ You were telling me there are a lot of demos from this period. How many unreleased songs you think Hang David left behind?

There was probably 5 or 6 other good songs from this period & maybe 9 or 10 from later on (and a load of really iffy songs!). They are in my shed somewhere on cassette.

++ After this 7″ you released the Head 12″. On this record the band changed a bit their sound. Why was that?

Nick & Ben left the band. I think they just wanted to do their own thing – it was all very amicable and we stayed friends and I think we played some gigs with them. Anyway, we got a new singer (Jon Braman) who also played bass and a new guitarist (Dave Turner). As a result we changed quite a bit naturally with the new line up.

++ I read that during this time you also played in the US? Is that so?

Yes, we played at CBGBs and somewhere at New York University I think (Syracuse?) in 88, before “Another Day” came out. I played again solo a few years later at CBs Gallery & The Bitter End in NY. I loved it – especially CBGBS of course. We scrawled Hang David on the stage wall, as was the tradition!

++ And in general, when it comes to gigs, what were the best gigs you played? Any anecdotes you could share? Any favourite bands to play with?

CBGBs with Hang David was a highlight and Clem Burke was playing on the same night (not with Blondie), which was great. Later Duma played a festival in Germany which was fun. I can’t remember any particular bands that stood out.

The anecdotes were mostly things that seemed like disasters at the time, but are funny now – driving all the way to Germany for a gig that hadn’t been booked (the very nice local band who were actually booked let us play anyway), powercuts, drummers breaking bones just before a big gig.

I actually had a solo melatone gig where as I stepped on stage to start, the fire alarm went off and didn’t stop all night. The venue cancelled the gig and refunded me all the cash that people had paid for their tickets (not just the usual band cut), which meant that the most I ever got paid for a gig, was for one I never did. I just took the audience to a nearby pub and used it to buy beer for everyone anyway!

We even did a Hang David reunion gig a couple of years ago (our first gig for 18 years) and Dave the drummer broke his finger 2 days before the gig, and we had to postpone.

++ For the song “Head” you filmed a promo video. How was that experience? What was the idea behind it and were you happy with the end result?

I don’t remember much about the planning – I think I pretty much turned up and did what I was told. Jon the singer also worked as a video editor and was pretty much in charge of it. He got some mates together and we filmed it in the front room of a flat in Highgate, North London (very glamorous!) When they got the film back it was really dark and we were worried it was unusable, but I think it looks great in a moody kind of way. We actually shot a video for Another Day as well, but it never got finished.  I guess there’s footage somewhere.

++ With the strength of these two releases, was there any interest from other labels to release you?

We never quite got enough momentum going – we did Another Day then changed singer, we did Head, then split up. We had interest from a couple of places, but nothing concrete – I remember getting lots of crazy, incomprehensible faxes from a company in Japan wanting to release us, but we couldn’t understand what they were saying.

++ What about press, did you get any attention by the likes of the NME or Melody Maker perhaps? And what about radio?

Yes, we got a great review from Melody Maker for “Another Day” & the “Head” video was on MTV a few times which was great. Both singles got some radio play around the country.

++ Then what happened with Hang David? When and why did you call it a day?

We called it a day after Head, I think it was in 92 or 93. I think we kind of put all our effort into that and then didn’t have the energy to follow it up properly. Everyone was at different stages – I just wanted to do music, but Jon’s video editing was going really well, Bob was at University I think, so we just couldn’t all commit.

++ What did the members of Hang David do afterwards?

I learned how to sing and formed Duma, and then melatone and I work at a music company in London. Jon carried on video editing, but also plays bass in melatone sometimes. Dave the drummer is also a video editor, Bob works in market research doing something clever, Dave Turner works in music and film industry. Ben works in A&R. Not sure what happened to Nick the Another Day singer, although I bumped into him at a gig a few years ago. And the “Head“ line up did a reunion gig a couple of years ago, which was a lot of fun. We played Another Day of course.

++ What about today, do you still make music? What other hobbies do you enjoy doing?

Yes, I still play gigs and have a studio set up. Melatone had an album (100 Different Ways To Change Your Life) out a couple of years ago & a new album (It’s The Hope That Kills You) is coming out this year. I have a couple of videos on you tube & vimeo & the album is on iTunes etc. I still love music, so I guess I will always find some way to do it.

++ Looking back in time, what would you say was the highlight of the band?

It was the obvious, simple things – actually seeing our first record and playing it, hearing it on the radio for the first time, seeing the Head video on MTV etc.

++ Thanks again Matt! It’s been great to know a bit more about your band. Anything else you’d like to add?

Thanks for the interest. To be honest I had no idea that anyone apart from a few friends would even remember the band. It makes it that bit more worthwhile and it’s nice to know that the music is still being enjoyed.

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Listen
Hang David – Another Day